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Post by gezzer on Oct 19, 2019 17:55:07 GMT
Haringey Borough players walk off in their FA Cup game against Yeovil Town after their Goalkeeper is racially abused by visiting fans. Watch how quickly the authorities jump on Haringey Borough! They haven’t got the bottle to address the real problem. Neither did today’s referee by the sound of things. It will be interesting to see what they do as it will set a precedent. Later stories have changed to spitting and bottle throwing at the GK and the racist abuse was aimed at a defender. Their Manager has said he doesn't care if they are thrown out of the competition.
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Post by Wortleyblue on Oct 19, 2019 18:25:33 GMT
It doesn't matter who it was aimed at if its happened then the FA should deal with it harshly but this is grassroots the FA will probably take the easy way out and throw out Haringey for not completeing the game it will be interesting to see the outcome
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Post by Lobster on Oct 20, 2019 9:10:34 GMT
I don't think even the FA would be stupid and out of touch enough to throw Haringey out for walking off the pitch. It would look awful, less than a week after the Bulgaria incident.
It's a difficult one though. Awarding the game to Haringey sets a dangerous precedent. If a team is two or three goals down, does that mean they can just "hear" racist abuse, leave the pitch and have the game awarded to them?
The fairest solution is probably to replay the game behind closed doors. Possibly the best PR move for Yeovil though would be to resign from the competition and give Haringey a bye.
This may be controversial, but I also think some players could do with a bit of education on how not to make the situation worse. I watched the highlights of the Hartlepool game a few weeks away where racist allegations were made, and it all started because a Dover player did a full on 'Andy Cook' celebration in front of the home fans. Of course, that doesn't make racist abuse at all acceptable, but it is confrontational behaviour which makes things more likely to boil over. I don't think it was the wisest of comments from Jordan Henderson about wanting to "punish" Bulgaria on the pitch by running up a huge victory. Not in any way trying to defend racists, but we'd all rather not be having these discussions, so we should all do what we can not to inflame situations.
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Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Oct 20, 2019 15:47:32 GMT
Hearts are investigating after claims the Mighty Gers’ El Buffalo (Alfredo Morelos) was racially abused in the 1-1 draw at Tynecastle today. On top of that, Bristol City are investigating after allegations of racial abuse at their game at Luton. It’s getting ridiculous now.
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Post by rcb on Oct 20, 2019 16:19:03 GMT
Hearts are investigating after claims the Mighty Gers’ El Buffalo (Alfredo Morelos) was racially abused in the 1-1 draw at Tynecastle today. On top of that, Bristol City are investigating after allegations of racial abuse at their game at Luton. It’s getting ridiculous now. At least Morelos can speak up for himself. What about the poor buffalo?
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Post by Lobster on Oct 20, 2019 16:43:00 GMT
Hearts are investigating after claims the Mighty Gers’ El Buffalo (Alfredo Morelos) was racially abused in the 1-1 draw at Tynecastle today. On top of that, Bristol City are investigating after allegations of racial abuse at their game at Luton. It’s getting ridiculous now. If teams are concerned about racial abuse, should they not be following the "three step" procedure we saw used in the England game rather than mentioning it afterwards, or is that just for UEFA international fixtures? Did Haringey do that yesterday or did they just walk off the pitch?
Don't get me wrong, I applaud any efforts to get racism out of the game, but I hope this doesn't get misused. I remember a game at the Deva about 15 years ago (think Southend were the opposition?) where a black player claimed to have heard monkey noises in the crowd, but the consensus among our fans was that it was just standard booing about a previous foul or bit of play-acting.
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Post by bing on Oct 20, 2019 18:28:06 GMT
What I don't understand is that, if one person is racially abusing a player, if the bobbies/stewards get involved, surely the perpetrator could be flushed out by those around him?
Surely the 'we don't grass up one of our own' rule is null and void in this situation? I'd hope so as it would send out a strong message that they're not welcome.
I don't like the idea of games being abandoned. If it happened to us, why should 1,999 fans be punished because of one person?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2019 19:18:33 GMT
Reports of it happening in Serie A game involving Rome and Sampdoria today
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Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Oct 21, 2019 19:49:00 GMT
Another incident reported, involving Salford fans at Northampton on Saturday.
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Post by Rio Doherty on Oct 21, 2019 19:55:21 GMT
A Man United fan was thrown out yesterday after allegedly racially abusing Trent Alexander-Arnold.
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Post by Neil Hunt Nonsense Potter on Oct 22, 2019 8:01:20 GMT
A Man United fan was thrown out yesterday after allegedly racially abusing Trent Alexander-Arnold. Thrown out isn't enough. Should be charged and prosecuted.
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Post by rcb on Oct 22, 2019 8:27:32 GMT
A Man United fan was thrown out yesterday after allegedly racially abusing Trent Alexander-Arnold. Thrown out isn't enough. Should be charged and prosecuted. Allegedly is the current status. Prosecution occurs only when a charge is proven.
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Post by Neil Hunt Nonsense Potter on Oct 22, 2019 9:20:03 GMT
Thrown out isn't enough. Should be charged and prosecuted. Allegedly is the current status. Prosecution occurs only when a charge is proven. So they were thrown out of the ground for allegations of racism? Surely proof must be obtained before removing them? Eyewitnesses etc? If these exist, then they should be charged and hopefully a prosecution could be secured for these imbeciles.
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Post by eyeswideopen on Oct 22, 2019 10:36:04 GMT
Allegedly is the current status. Prosecution occurs only when a charge is proven. So they were thrown out of the ground for allegations of racism? Surely proof must be obtained before removing them? Eyewitnesses etc? If these exist, then they should be charged and hopefully a prosecution could be secured for these imbeciles. Like most things reported on social media these days, it probably never happened. Edit Now confirmed by United as actually happening www.bbc.com/sport/football/50130001Pretty poor as a poster said previously to just eject them, should have been reported to the police at the time and arrested.
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Post by Micky Wilde on Oct 22, 2019 14:35:23 GMT
True story. I went racing yesterday on a works jolley. Our waiter was a young (British) black lad and at one point the "fat, Scouse B*****d" who I was sat next to said "What u talking about Willis?" There was a sharp intake of breath by a couple of snowflakes in the group which prompted the waiter to say "don't know what you're talking about but judging by their reaction it was racist" I explained that it was a quote from the program Different Strokes. The FSB then went on to say nothing racist and nothing different to people shouting "gizza job" to him as he was growing up. At the end of the day the waiter came up to us and during his break he watched a few clips of Different Strokes and found them hilarious and definitely not racist. Point is imo some in society today are jumping on the racist, homophobia, PC bandwagon without understanding what they are on about. Just mentioning a persons colour, sexual orientation etc leads to allegations of bigotry. New generations are more accepting of todays culture and therefore any Old Farts who are not already educated will eventually Die out and hopefully take their bigoted views to the grave with them. This never happened
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2019 15:56:42 GMT
From the BBC website
Draw your own conclusions, folks.
Bulgaria have been ordered to play two matches behind closed doors - one suspended for two years - for their fans' racist abuse of England players in a Euro 2020 qualifier.
England's 6-0 win in Sofia was stopped twice and could have been abandoned, but the visitors chose to play on.
The hosts already had a partial stadium closure for that match on October 15 because of previous racist behaviour.
Bulgaria have also been fined 75,000 euros (£65,000) by Uefa.
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Post by btb on Oct 29, 2019 17:12:54 GMT
From the BBC website Draw your own conclusions, folks. Bulgaria have been ordered to play two matches behind closed doors - one suspended for two years - for their fans' racist abuse of England players in a Euro 2020 qualifier. England's 6-0 win in Sofia was stopped twice and could have been abandoned, but the visitors chose to play on. The hosts already had a partial stadium closure for that match on October 15 because of previous racist behaviour. Bulgaria have also been fined 75,000 euros (£65,000) by Uefa. On the back of their previous ground closure how is this latest punishment anywhere near enough? Completely sends out the wrong message, again.
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Post by Hannibal on Oct 29, 2019 17:13:08 GMT
From the BBC website Draw your own conclusions, folks. Bulgaria have been ordered to play two matches behind closed doors - one suspended for two years - for their fans' racist abuse of England players in a Euro 2020 qualifier. England's 6-0 win in Sofia was stopped twice and could have been abandoned, but the visitors chose to play on. The hosts already had a partial stadium closure for that match on October 15 because of previous racist behaviour. Bulgaria have also been fined 75,000 euros (£65,000) by Uefa. I feel this is their last chance. Any further infringements ought to result in them being banned from several major tournaments
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Post by rcb on Oct 29, 2019 20:46:35 GMT
Nothing wrong with the Bulgarian football team. Some of their supporters are socially inept, in which case deal with the guilty. Ban home internationals.
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Post by Lobster on Oct 29, 2019 20:48:56 GMT
From the BBC website Draw your own conclusions, folks. Bulgaria have been ordered to play two matches behind closed doors - one suspended for two years - for their fans' racist abuse of England players in a Euro 2020 qualifier. England's 6-0 win in Sofia was stopped twice and could have been abandoned, but the visitors chose to play on. The hosts already had a partial stadium closure for that match on October 15 because of previous racist behaviour. Bulgaria have also been fined 75,000 euros (£65,000) by Uefa.Just £12,000 more than England were fined for wearing "unauthorised socks" during the 2018 World Cup.
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Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Dec 23, 2019 1:16:01 GMT
Here we go again. Disgusting scenes at Spurs this afternoon but shockingly worsened by the bizarre comments of Sky Sports presenter David Jones following Gary Neville’s spot-on summary of a societal problem that has undoubtedly escalated since the result of the GE a week ago as racists feel emboldened to do whatever they like.
Jones was clearly instructed by a producer to say: “These are the views of Gary Neville, not of Sky Sports” which was quite bizarre. When Neville rightly called him out on that, asking whether or not Jones agreed with his summary, Jones started talking about “bringing balance” to the debate.
Balance. To a debate on RACISM.
Again, Neville called him out.
The whole thing made for uncomfortable viewing but what do you expect from a Murdoch-influenced broadcaster? Standard.
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Post by Imperial on Dec 23, 2019 1:28:16 GMT
Here we go again. Disgusting scenes at Spurs this afternoon but shockingly worsened by the bizarre comments of Sky Sports presenter David Jones following Gary Neville’s spot-on summary of a societal problem that has undoubtedly escalated since the result of the GE a week ago as racists feel emboldened to do whatever they like. Jones was clearly instructed by a producer to say: “These are the views of Gary Neville, not of Sky Sports” which was quite bizarre. When Neville rightly called him out on that, asking whether or not Jones agreed with his summary, Jones started talking about “bringing balance” to the debate. Balance. To a debate on RACISM. Again, Neville called him out. The whole thing made for uncomfortable viewing but what do you expect from a Murdoch-influenced broadcaster? Standard. Don’t have Sky so haven’t seen any of this. Did Neville blame the landslide Tory victory for Spurs fans alleged racist behaviour or did you add that? Because if it was Neville then any broadcaster is right to try to balance the debate. Regardless your comments come across as though you think that racism isn’t a controversial subject. It clearly is. The vast majority of people would agree that abusing people about their skin colour based on prejudice is wrong. But on the other hand statements like “white people cannot be victims of racism” or “The UK is 100% racist” are extremely controversial & again, should be covered in a balanced manner.
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Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Dec 23, 2019 1:46:07 GMT
Here we go again. Disgusting scenes at Spurs this afternoon but shockingly worsened by the bizarre comments of Sky Sports presenter David Jones following Gary Neville’s spot-on summary of a societal problem that has undoubtedly escalated since the result of the GE a week ago as racists feel emboldened to do whatever they like. Jones was clearly instructed by a producer to say: “These are the views of Gary Neville, not of Sky Sports” which was quite bizarre. When Neville rightly called him out on that, asking whether or not Jones agreed with his summary, Jones started talking about “bringing balance” to the debate. Balance. To a debate on RACISM. Again, Neville called him out. The whole thing made for uncomfortable viewing but what do you expect from a Murdoch-influenced broadcaster? Standard. Don’t have Sky so haven’t seen any of this. Did Neville blame the landslide Tory victory for Spurs fans alleged racist behaviour or did you add that? Because if it was Neville then any broadcaster is right to try to balance the debate. Regardless your comments come across as though you think that racism isn’t a controversial subject. It clearly is. The vast majority of people would agree that abusing people about their skin colour based on prejudice is wrong. But on the other hand statements like “white people cannot be victims of racism” or “The UK is 100% racist” are extremely controversial & again, should be covered in a balanced manner. Neville mentioned that both of the main political leaders have had “accusations of racism” against them - I suspect that’s the point Jones was instructed to distance from, but there is nothing incorrect or libellous about that specific statement (“accusations of...”). When Jones was asked by Neville for his personal opinion he could’ve agreed but bizarrely spoke of needing to have a balanced debate on this subject. This is probably where you and I may disagree as I would not entertain a balanced debate on the subject of racism - would they pit Neville against Yaxley-Lennon in the studio? He chose to agree with Neville and apologise hours later on Twitter - too late and to a smaller audience. With regards your reference to Stormzy I had you down as too clever to fall into the trap set by the rabid press who have utterly, yet deliberately, misrepresented his comment about racism in Britain. He was asked if he thinks Britain is a racist country and his reply was “definitely, 100%” - the “100%” in that context clearly just doubling down on the “yes” but this was completely misconstrued and ITV have since apologised and taken down their misleading headline from their social media pages (the Daily Heil haven’t of course!). Journalist: “Is there cheese in the U.K.?” Stormzy: “Definitely, 100%” ITV News: “BREAKING - Stormzy says the U.K. is 100% cheese.” See what I mean?
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Post by Imperial on Dec 23, 2019 2:01:20 GMT
Don’t have Sky so haven’t seen any of this. Did Neville blame the landslide Tory victory for Spurs fans alleged racist behaviour or did you add that? Because if it was Neville then any broadcaster is right to try to balance the debate. Regardless your comments come across as though you think that racism isn’t a controversial subject. It clearly is. The vast majority of people would agree that abusing people about their skin colour based on prejudice is wrong. But on the other hand statements like “white people cannot be victims of racism” or “The UK is 100% racist” are extremely controversial & again, should be covered in a balanced manner. Neville mentioned that both of the main political leaders have had “accusations of racism” against them - I suspect that’s the point Jones was instructed to distance from, but there is nothing incorrect or libellous about that specific statement (“accusations of...”). When Jones was asked by Neville for his personal opinion he could’ve agreed but bizarrely spoke of needing to have a balanced debate on this subject. This is probably where you and I may disagree as I would not entertain a balanced debate on the subject of racism - would they pit Neville against Yaxley-Lennon in the studio? He chose to agree with Neville and apologise hours later on Twitter - too late and to a smaller audience. With regards your reference to Stormzy I had you down as too clever to fall into the trap set by the rabid press who have utterly, yet deliberately, misrepresented his comment about racism in Britain. He was asked if he thinks Britain is a racist country and his reply was “definitely, 100%” - the “100%” in that context clearly just doubling down on the “yes” but this was completely misconstrued and ITV have since apologised and taken down their misleading headline from their social media pages (the Daily Heil haven’t of course!). Journalist: “Is there cheese in the U.K.?” Stormzy: “Definitely, 100%” ITV News: “BREAKING - Stormzy says the U.K. is 100% cheese.” See what I mean? Yeah we would, regardless of the topic there should always be a balanced debate. You don’t eliminate ideas by suppressing them. But that’s a different debate. It sounds (again hearing it 2nd hand) as though Jones was trying to avoid coming down on a side & Neville pushed him. I’d only seen the “headlines” on twitter etc so happy to accept what you’re saying, that doesn’t change the point I was making though; racism as a topic is often controversial despite almost everyone accepting racism is bad. You’ve changed the wording there though. A better example would be “Is the UK a nation that hates cheese?” & that changes the meaning of his answer significantly. According to you he stated that the UK is 100% a racist country. The implications of that are wide ranging but at a minimum I’d say that they include accusing the majority of Brits of being racist & that Britain is more racist than it’s international equals. Both of which are demonstrably untrue.
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Post by Ian H Block on Dec 23, 2019 5:25:56 GMT
Neville mentioned that both of the main political leaders have had “accusations of racism” against them - I suspect that’s the point Jones was instructed to distance from, but there is nothing incorrect or libellous about that specific statement (“accusations of...”). When Jones was asked by Neville for his personal opinion he could’ve agreed but bizarrely spoke of needing to have a balanced debate on this subject. This is probably where you and I may disagree as I would not entertain a balanced debate on the subject of racism - would they pit Neville against Yaxley-Lennon in the studio? He chose to agree with Neville and apologise hours later on Twitter - too late and to a smaller audience. With regards your reference to Stormzy I had you down as too clever to fall into the trap set by the rabid press who have utterly, yet deliberately, misrepresented his comment about racism in Britain. He was asked if he thinks Britain is a racist country and his reply was “definitely, 100%” - the “100%” in that context clearly just doubling down on the “yes” but this was completely misconstrued and ITV have since apologised and taken down their misleading headline from their social media pages (the Daily Heil haven’t of course!). Journalist: “Is there cheese in the U.K.?” Stormzy: “Definitely, 100%” ITV News: “BREAKING - Stormzy says the U.K. is 100% cheese.” See what I mean? Yeah we would, regardless of the topic there should always be a balanced debate. You don’t eliminate ideas by suppressing them. But that’s a different debate. It sounds (again hearing it 2nd hand) as though Jones was trying to avoid coming down on a side & Neville pushed him. I’d only seen the “headlines” on twitter etc so happy to accept what you’re saying, that doesn’t change the point I was making though; racism as a topic is often controversial despite almost everyone accepting racism is bad. You’ve changed the wording there though. A better example would be “Is the UK a nation that hates cheese?” & that changes the meaning of his answer significantly. According to you he stated that the UK is 100% a racist country. The implications of that are wide ranging but at a minimum I’d say that they include accusing the majority of Brits of being racist & that Britain is more racist than it’s international equals. Both of which are demonstrably untrue. But that’s not what he said or meant, so don’t twist his words.
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Post by Lobster on Dec 23, 2019 7:18:03 GMT
Neville mentioned that both of the main political leaders have had “accusations of racism” against them - I suspect that’s the point Jones was instructed to distance from, but there is nothing incorrect or libellous about that specific statement (“accusations of...”). When Jones was asked by Neville for his personal opinion he could’ve agreed but bizarrely spoke of needing to have a balanced debate on this subject. This is probably where you and I may disagree as I would not entertain a balanced debate on the subject of racism - would they pit Neville against Yaxley-Lennon in the studio? He chose to agree with Neville and apologise hours later on Twitter - too late and to a smaller audience. With regards your reference to Stormzy I had you down as too clever to fall into the trap set by the rabid press who have utterly, yet deliberately, misrepresented his comment about racism in Britain. He was asked if he thinks Britain is a racist country and his reply was “definitely, 100%” - the “100%” in that context clearly just doubling down on the “yes” but this was completely misconstrued and ITV have since apologised and taken down their misleading headline from their social media pages (the Daily Heil haven’t of course!). Journalist: “Is there cheese in the U.K.?” Stormzy: “Definitely, 100%” ITV News: “BREAKING - Stormzy says the U.K. is 100% cheese.” See what I mean? Yeah we would, regardless of the topic there should always be a balanced debate. You don’t eliminate ideas by suppressing them. But that’s a different debate. It sounds (again hearing it 2nd hand) as though Jones was trying to avoid coming down on a side & Neville pushed him. I’d only seen the “headlines” on twitter etc so happy to accept what you’re saying, that doesn’t change the point I was making though; racism as a topic is often controversial despite almost everyone accepting racism is bad. You’ve changed the wording there though. A better example would be “Is the UK a nation that hates cheese?” & that changes the meaning of his answer significantly. According to you he stated that the UK is 100% a racist country. The implications of that are wide ranging but at a minimum I’d say that they include accusing the majority of Brits of being racist & that Britain is more racist than it’s international equals. Both of which are demonstrably untrue. It doesn't mean either of those things. For a start, he was talking to Italian media, and went on to say that racism is not as overt as in Italy, but it's still a problem in the UK. If you're taking it literally, he's not saying the "majority" of Brits are racist, he's saying they ALL are. That would include himself! That's clearly not what he meant. The "100%" was a figure of speech used to confirm his answer of "yes", in the same way that something like "absolutely" could be. The tabloids are kind of proving his point by obscuring his argument and reducing it to a "black man says all white Brits are racist" headline to agitate their readership.
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Post by Imperial on Dec 23, 2019 11:30:04 GMT
Yeah we would, regardless of the topic there should always be a balanced debate. You don’t eliminate ideas by suppressing them. But that’s a different debate. It sounds (again hearing it 2nd hand) as though Jones was trying to avoid coming down on a side & Neville pushed him. I’d only seen the “headlines” on twitter etc so happy to accept what you’re saying, that doesn’t change the point I was making though; racism as a topic is often controversial despite almost everyone accepting racism is bad. You’ve changed the wording there though. A better example would be “Is the UK a nation that hates cheese?” & that changes the meaning of his answer significantly. According to you he stated that the UK is 100% a racist country. The implications of that are wide ranging but at a minimum I’d say that they include accusing the majority of Brits of being racist & that Britain is more racist than it’s international equals. Both of which are demonstrably untrue. But that’s not what he said or meant, so don’t twist his words. What?
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Post by Imperial on Dec 23, 2019 11:32:23 GMT
Yeah we would, regardless of the topic there should always be a balanced debate. You don’t eliminate ideas by suppressing them. But that’s a different debate. It sounds (again hearing it 2nd hand) as though Jones was trying to avoid coming down on a side & Neville pushed him. I’d only seen the “headlines” on twitter etc so happy to accept what you’re saying, that doesn’t change the point I was making though; racism as a topic is often controversial despite almost everyone accepting racism is bad. You’ve changed the wording there though. A better example would be “Is the UK a nation that hates cheese?” & that changes the meaning of his answer significantly. According to you he stated that the UK is 100% a racist country. The implications of that are wide ranging but at a minimum I’d say that they include accusing the majority of Brits of being racist & that Britain is more racist than it’s international equals. Both of which are demonstrably untrue. It doesn't mean either of those things. For a start, he was talking to Italian media, and went on to say that racism is not as overt as in Italy, but it's still a problem in the UK. If you're taking it literally, he's not saying the "majority" of Brits are racist, he's saying they ALL are. That would include himself! That's clearly not what he meant. The "100%" was a figure of speech used to confirm his answer of "yes", in the same way that something like "absolutely" could be. The tabloids are kind of proving his point by obscuring his argument and reducing it to a "black man says all white Brits are racist" headline to agitate their readership. That’s not what I was saying, if he is describing the UK as a racist country then the implication is that most people are racist or racism is extremely commonplace. If you said the UK was a socialist country it means an entirely different thing to “the UK is a country that has a lot of socialists”.
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ddod
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Post by ddod on Dec 23, 2019 12:30:21 GMT
Nathen yet again taking a thread away from what it should be about. As for Spurs and Chelsea. The racism I can't understand, they both have black players on their team. I know a plastic Liverpool fan who hates muslims, yet likes Mo Salah. People are strange, and for the most part. Can't be changed.
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Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Dec 23, 2019 13:11:10 GMT
Racism is deeply rooted in UK elite policy and society. Does anyone really believe governments could so easily get away with helping to kill Yemenis, Iraqis, Syrians etc etc, as *routine* in foreign policy if those populations were white? If anything Stormzy has understated the problem.
Football is simply a microcosm of society.
The fact that one or two posters seem to be taking offence to the way this issue has been raised rather than to the actual racism says it all for me.
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