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Post by bitbbh on Apr 17, 2018 19:04:27 GMT
My worries about the future of our club are compounding.
The FWG have briefly outlined a plan how the future of the club on the playing side will go forward. Local recruitment, u23 age group players, player pathway etc. It seems that this strategic thinking ignored or failed to seek the football professionals advice at the club.
Like i have said previously the more sensible approach for next season would have been a hybrid part time model where you are able to bring in players tried and tested in the National North along side the best of our home produced talent.
I personally feel that we will be way off the pace if we move to a completely different model of recruitment given that we plan to stay full time rather than look at using tried and trusted battle hardened Conference North players.
It seems that the budget will be circa 250k of which we have committed or offered new contracts which will total circa 200k. Leaving just 50k in the budget to recruit maybe 10/12 players.
It seems that the board are pinning their hopes on the contracted players moving on this summer but i cant see this happening without a substantial cost to the club depending on the relevant contracts they are able to fix themselves up with.
The board have annouced season ticket prices for next season which are favourable and hopefully the majority that purchased them this season will buy them for next season.
The major concern is that the board have budgeted for circa 800 walk up on the day fans and as we know this is currently a very precarious position should we not have a winning team on the pitch.
I would ask the board and FWG to speak to football professionals and outline their plans in detail and take on board their findings rather than think they are taking the best way forward.
I want to be looking forward to me and my son watching us playing football at the highest level possible in season 2019/20.
However if next season does not bring us winning football those budgeted 800 walk up fans will dwindle away again and i cant see the fanbase stomaching another bail out because the club ignored the advice of football professionals and those in the fanbase expressing grave concerns.
It times for the FWG and the Board to listen to the concerns of the fanbase before they embark on their vision of football utopia at a time when we need stability and security.
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Post by silverblue on Apr 17, 2018 19:16:40 GMT
They are listening to the fans, they are called working groups, anyone is allowed to join. If you feel you have something to contribute and they club should listen, please go along and join them
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Post by bitbbh on Apr 17, 2018 19:36:33 GMT
They are listening to the fans, they are called working groups, anyone is allowed to join. If you feel you have something to contribute and they club should listen, please go along and join them The point is they are not embracing concerns. They have ignored concerns from people who have been there and done it. Im not saying that vision wont work, it is something that has to be introduced lover ime and carefully planned for and in my opinion next season is not the season to do it. I dont get why individual fans who are concerned should be polarised because they are not part of a working group. This club is owned by all of us is it not? For your information i have offered my assistance to both the FWG and the fundraising working group. I will be attending the fundraising woeking group meeting on Thursday night however the FWG have yet to respond to my offer of assistance despite me offering my assistance to Calvin back in January.
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Post by Jack on Apr 17, 2018 19:44:13 GMT
Absolutely agree.
I want to see that vision of 23 year olds brought in, developed and sold on as part of the club's identity moving forward. The board are right to seek that model, but next season needs to be one which our main aim is to 'stop the bleeding' as NY put it. Revert to part time, bring in some decent professionals and win a few games. Once we've consolidated in this league, the conversation about full time football can come back onto the table.
To do anything else with a budget like ours is reckless in the extreme. There's a high probability we will do a North Ferriby and be relegated by March if we aren't very careful about this.
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Post by paulie on Apr 17, 2018 19:45:59 GMT
They are listening to the fans, they are called working groups, anyone is allowed to join. If you feel you have something to contribute and they club should listen, please go along and join them The point is they are not embracing concerns. They have ignored concerns from people who have been there and done it. Im not saying that vision wont work, it is something that has to be introduced lover ime and carefully planned for and in my opinion next season is not the season to do it. I dont get why individual fans who are concerned should be polarised because they are not part of a working group. This club is owned by all of us is it not? For your information i have offered my assistance to both the FWG and the fundraising working group. I will be attending the fundraising woeking group meeting on Thursday night however the FWG have yet to respond to my offer of assistance despite me offering my assistance to Calvin back in January. Unbelievable! The FWG "aka" Calvin Hughes have now refused the offer of support from 2 conference north winning manager and a ex league club owner. This man must be the fount of all knowledge when it comes to football, cannot wait to see what tricks he has up his sleeve. The more that I read about this Calvin Hughes character the more I'm starting to believe what Charlie crosdale tweeted to rock the boat last month.
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Post by Al on Apr 17, 2018 19:48:00 GMT
I agree fully.
Even short term the idea of having a full side team composed of basically untried and untested kids will give us nothing but more men v boys games.
These kids need nurturing, not all throwing in at the deep end and seeing if they sink or swim. It will just lead us back to the Evo Stik.
Long term to go for U23 recruitment and full time with the academy and scholarship programme yep all for it, LONG TERM. But now, right now everything has to be about making sure this football club does not suffer a double relegation. for the GOOD OF THE CLUB, we have to look at reverting to part time next season. Even if it is for just one season.
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Post by hbomb on Apr 17, 2018 19:49:25 GMT
This is part of the problem for me. Bitbbh has raised some very valid points. He has concerns I have as well. And what’s the 1st response. A defensive why don’t you join a working group. Well guess what. Some of us can’t. I’m too busy. I have a lot on. But I do appreciate what the groups do. But this isn’t answering the concerns raised. They are genuine and something that needs addressing.
Or because I haven’t the time to contribute to a working group I’m not a real fan and my view doesn’t count. I’ve got a season ticket and contributed to the fund raising though. Is that ok?
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Post by Al on Apr 17, 2018 19:49:35 GMT
The point is they are not embracing concerns. They have ignored concerns from people who have been there and done it. Im not saying that vision wont work, it is something that has to be introduced lover ime and carefully planned for and in my opinion next season is not the season to do it. I dont get why individual fans who are concerned should be polarised because they are not part of a working group. This club is owned by all of us is it not? For your information i have offered my assistance to both the FWG and the fundraising working group. I will be attending the fundraising woeking group meeting on Thursday night however the FWG have yet to respond to my offer of assistance despite me offering my assistance to Calvin back in January. Unbelievable! The FWG "aka" Calvin Hughes have now refused the offer of support from 2 conference north winning manager and a ex league club owner. This man must be the fount of all knowledge when it comes to football, cannot wait to see what tricks he has up his sleeve. The more that I read about this Calvin Hughes character the more I'm starting to believe what Charlie crosdale tweeted to rock the boat last month. Remember, Bignot wanted us to remain full time next season
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Post by Suomen Sininen on Apr 17, 2018 20:28:36 GMT
Unbelievable! The FWG "aka" Calvin Hughes have now refused the offer of support from 2 conference north winning manager and a ex league club owner. This man must be the fount of all knowledge when it comes to football, cannot wait to see what tricks he has up his sleeve. The more that I read about this Calvin Hughes character the more I'm starting to believe what Charlie crosdale tweeted to rock the boat last month. Remember, Bignot wanted us to remain full time next season But not just with untested kids I guess. Surely the hybrid version. These are very worrying times. I listened to the podcast and as much as I respect what Mark Howells said about Calvin, I'm struggling to find a positive yet. He came across quite badly in the interview regards the new proposed set up, the search criterea for the new manager/head coach, the dismissive attitude regarding taking advice from two ex-managers, declining help from Paul Baker, and not to mention the decision making with regards the timing and place of Bignotts sacking. If someone can convince me why I should have any faith in the FWG taking the club forward, please tell me. He is a volunteer and that is commenable, as was his excellent service for the first 4 years or so as our football secretary, but it seems like he is now taking on too much and is losing sight of the short term footballing goal - survival in the conference north.
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Post by bluetartan on Apr 17, 2018 20:35:51 GMT
If as bear states that his offer of help or assistance has not been responded to then it may have been genuinely lost in the carnage over the past few months. Surely someone from the board or one of these working groups reading this thread on here could give Mr Hughes a nudge even if to acknowledge the request and offer feedback. I understand people should be very busy but any offer of help particularly when it’s heartfelt and from someone with knowledge of outside business and football both with this club and Bournemouth should be listened to at least.
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Post by bitbbh on Apr 17, 2018 20:48:51 GMT
It was a face to face offer to Calvin at the crisis meeting in January.
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Post by bluetartan on Apr 17, 2018 20:52:11 GMT
Then that is poor bear, I hope it has been misinterpreted or a selective moment of amnesia, someone please give the board a nudge.
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Post by jb on Apr 17, 2018 21:09:02 GMT
Sounds like one individual is trying to live out his “Championship Manager” dreams much to the detriment of the club.
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Post by Harry Lime on Apr 17, 2018 21:32:48 GMT
I believe the original post reflects the concerns of a number of supporters.
Unless Calvin is very sure that the players on contracts can be moved on, the risk is too great. Realistically we'll still be part paying them to play for someone else, affecting the budget.
The walk up supporters (800??) won't turn up for we're getting outplayed and losing most weeks. These are dark times. It would be interesting to know whether the whole FWG agree with this approach, or just the more forceful members.
Everything is being risked on the clear out and the youth stepping up. Youth players normally need experienced players around them. Especially in a physical league.
What they are proposing is a risk. If it comes off, it will be seen as the right approach. If they are wrong, the result doesn't bear thinking about.
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Post by rcb on Apr 17, 2018 21:48:59 GMT
I clearly remember the very poor quality of refereeing from level 6, 7, and 8. The amount of blatant fouls to downright bullying that went on was appalling. I only watched it because it was Chester, and regularly left at the end disappointed with the thuggery that referees generally allowed. The thought that the FWG see fit to send talented kids onto such a battlefield, relatively unprotected, is frightening.
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Post by jb on Apr 17, 2018 22:05:21 GMT
I clearly remember the very poor quality of refereeing from level 6, 7, and 8. The amount of blatant fouls to downright bullying that went on was appalling. I only watched it because it was Chester, and regularly left at the end disappointed with the thuggery that referees generally allowed. The thought that the FWG see fit to send talented kids onto such a battlefield, relatively unprotected, is frightening. We need some hard lads in like Bradley Barnes otherwise it’s going to be brutal.
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Post by dmcnally on Apr 17, 2018 22:11:27 GMT
1,700 is not a realistic average to base our budget on. Simple as that. We start poor we'll be getting a quarter of the projected walk-up. Then what? Heading towards the same crisis by Christmas.
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Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Apr 17, 2018 22:15:31 GMT
1,700 is not a realistic average to base our budget on. Simple as that. We start poor we'll be getting a quarter of the projected walk-up. Then what? Heading towards the same crisis by Christmas. Similarly budgeting for crowds of 1,000-1,200 would leave us with a pitiful amount to spend on players, especially if we are indeed to remain full time, and we'd be relegated by Christmas. Difficult balancing act for the board.
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Post by spencerwhelanleftpeg on Apr 17, 2018 22:21:40 GMT
My worries about the future of our club are compounding. The FWG have briefly outlined a plan how the future of the club on the playing side will go forward. Local recruitment, u23 age group players, player pathway etc. It seems that this strategic thinking ignored or failed to seek the football professionals advice at the club. Like i have said previously the more sensible approach for next season would have been a hybrid part time model where you are able to bring in players tried and tested in the National North along side the best of our home produced talent. I personally feel that we will be way off the pace if we move to a completely different model of recruitment given that we plan to stay full time rather than look at using tried and trusted battle hardened Conference North players. It seems that the budget will be circa 250k of which we have committed or offered new contracts which will total circa 200k. Leaving just 50k in the budget to recruit maybe 10/12 players. It seems that the board are pinning their hopes on the contracted players moving on this summer but i cant see this happening without a substantial cost to the club depending on the relevant contracts they are able to fix themselves up with. The board have annouced season ticket prices for next season which are favourable and hopefully the majority that purchased them this season will buy them for next season. The major concern is that the board have budgeted for circa 800 walk up on the day fans and as we know this is currently a very precarious position should we not have a winning team on the pitch. I would ask the board and FWG to speak to football professionals and outline their plans in detail and take on board their findings rather than think they are taking the best way forward. I want to be looking forward to me and my son watching us playing football at the highest level possible in season 2019/20. However if next season does not bring us winning football those budgeted 800 walk up fans will dwindle away again and i cant see the fanbase stomaching another bail out because the club ignored the advice of football professionals and those in the fanbase expressing grave concerns. It times for the FWG and the Board to listen to the concerns of the fanbase before they embark on their vision of football utopia at a time when we need stability and security. Good post and points very well Made. I have been frowned at on another thread but aside from the FWG we have two individuals on the current board who are quite clearly dangerous/ stubborn and set in their ways. That will clearly hinder us moving forward. The interview last Thursday leaves me to feel that any investment that may come is the only way of beating off a slow death.
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Post by dmcnally on Apr 17, 2018 22:30:15 GMT
1,700 is not a realistic average to base our budget on. Simple as that. We start poor we'll be getting a quarter of the projected walk-up. Then what? Heading towards the same crisis by Christmas. Similarly budgeting for crowds of 1,000-1,200 would leave us with a pitiful amount to spend on players, especially if we are indeed to remain full time, and we'd be relegated by Christmas. Difficult balancing act for the board. Rather be relegated and financially OK as long as we have some long-term infrastructure fundraising underway. Totally understand the balancing act but again they've chosen the optimistic route. That didn't end well this season, did it?
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Post by spencerwhelanleftpeg on Apr 17, 2018 22:30:53 GMT
The point is they are not embracing concerns. They have ignored concerns from people who have been there and done it. Im not saying that vision wont work, it is something that has to be introduced lover ime and carefully planned for and in my opinion next season is not the season to do it. I dont get why individual fans who are concerned should be polarised because they are not part of a working group. This club is owned by all of us is it not? For your information i have offered my assistance to both the FWG and the fundraising working group. I will be attending the fundraising woeking group meeting on Thursday night however the FWG have yet to respond to my offer of assistance despite me offering my assistance to Calvin back in January. Unbelievable! The FWG "aka" Calvin Hughes have now refused the offer of support from 2 conference north winning manager and a ex league club owner. This man must be the fount of all knowledge when it comes to football, cannot wait to see what tricks he has up his sleeve. The more that I read about this Calvin Hughes character the more I'm starting to believe what Charlie crosdale tweeted to rock the boat last month. If fans couldn’t tell or were not concerned about this man since the podcast last Thursday then we really are in trouble. Absolute liability unwilling to Listen etc. Needs removing before too much more damage is done. Haven’t we already seen enough this season? Perhaps that’s why SO and MH are no Longer involved. Surely fans must of listened to what I did and thought Jesus this guy is dangerous?
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Post by midfieldgeneral on Apr 18, 2018 5:42:48 GMT
There is some valid points being made here about whether we stay full time or go part time next season and what model best suits the financial constrains we are working under. I gat all that; but what I find amazingly unhelpful is the witch hunt being directed against certain individuals. The age proile of players undder the age of 25 is right, but we also know that these leagues require phyically strong athletic players to compete. Thats why we need a manager with experience of Conference North and the Evo stick I would have no problem with the likes of Archer Jones Crawford Roberts playing next season and even a couple more of the youth team joining the squad, so long as the rest of the squaad are young but with a couple of years experience of the North the Evo stick or the Welsh Premier. That is why the appointment of a new manager and recruitment is crucial. Probably MaCauley for me
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Post by chesterken on Apr 18, 2018 6:25:13 GMT
There is some valid points being made here about whether we stay full time or go part time next season and what model best suits the financial constrains we are working under. I gat all that; but what I find amazingly unhelpful is the witch hunt being directed against certain individuals. The age proile of players undder the age of 25 is right, but we also know that these leagues require phyically strong athletic players to compete. Thats why we need a manager with experience of Conference North and the Evo stick I would have no problem with the likes of Archer Jones Crawford Roberts playing next season and even a couple more of the youth team joining the squad, so long as the rest of the squaad are young but with a couple of years experience of the North the Evo stick or the Welsh Premier. That is why the appointment of a new manager and recruitment is crucial. Probably MaCauley for me You would probably have to wait 12 months to get him as he is under contract
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Post by Charfield Blue on Apr 18, 2018 7:00:18 GMT
Unbelievable! The FWG "aka" Calvin Hughes have now refused the offer of support from 2 conference north winning manager and a ex league club owner. This man must be the fount of all knowledge when it comes to football, cannot wait to see what tricks he has up his sleeve. The more that I read about this Calvin Hughes character the more I'm starting to believe what Charlie crosdale tweeted to rock the boat last month. If fans couldn’t tell or were not concerned about this man since the podcast last Thursday then we really are in trouble. Absolute liability unwilling to Listen etc. Needs removing before too much more damage is done. Haven’t we already seen enough this season? Perhaps that’s why SO and MH are no Longer involved. Surely fans must of listened to what I did and thought Jesus this guy is dangerous? Mark's stated reason for why he left was because of a perceived lack of board support of Calvin, so that's clearly not correct.
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Post by Si on Apr 18, 2018 8:13:56 GMT
It was a face to face offer to Calvin at the crisis meeting in January. That absolutely stinks. One of the key communications from the club recently is that they need help, whether it be football expertise or people to join the working groups. A man of your experience we would be lucky to have, so it's very concerning to hear that the club are not even acknowledging your offer. Without wanting to get into a witch hunt against certain individuals, it does make me wonder about people's motives when they have not taken the chance to get you involved.
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Post by Matt on Apr 18, 2018 8:21:33 GMT
Am I missing something here? We’re fan owned and clearly Calvin Hughes has been proved time again he’s been ignoring the help this Club needs. Need to get rid ASAP before he makes another group he’s in charge of.
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Post by alancfc on Apr 18, 2018 8:43:52 GMT
Whilst I do not agree with 'attacking' individuals, who after all are giving up their time for our club, we must be honest about their abilities. We have a Board of a Football Club, and a Football Working group, who are devoid of the qualities and experience required to appoint the most important senior position in a club, the Manager. Given that a man of experience in Neil Young has walked away, with all this knowledge of the local game, why haven't the board gone out and sourced some football experience? Why wouldn't you wish to seek Paul's experience and advice, when confronted with such a big decision? Would it hurt to ask Alan Tarbuck or Gary Talbot, or any of the other Former Blues, to sit on the 'Managerial Panel'? Have they not got decades of insight into how a football team is managed, yes the 'game had changed' but it still involves 22 men, 2 goals and one ball! And in a world where it is common place for senior positions in businesses to be filled from Recruitment Specialists, why not set aside a £3,000 fee to bring on a professional Football man into the process, to provide clear guidance and structure to ensure we install the best man? I'd rather they spend £3,000 now and get the right man, then think they can do it themselves and a lose us another £100K of gate receipts next year by appointing a dud.
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Post by paulie on Apr 18, 2018 8:57:35 GMT
It was a face to face offer to Calvin at the crisis meeting in January. That absolutely stinks. One of the key communications from the club recently is that they need help, whether it be football expertise or people to join the working groups. A man of your experience we would be lucky to have, so it's very concerning to hear that the club are not even acknowledging your offer. Without wanting to get into a witch hunt against certain individuals, it does make me wonder about people's motives when they have not taken the chance to get you involved. Calvin Sinatra "my way"
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2018 9:30:26 GMT
Am I missing something here? We’re fan owned and clearly Calvin Hughes has been proved time again he’s been ignoring the help this Club needs. Need to get rid ASAP before he makes another group he’s in charge of. Go and see him at the meeting tonight Matt and discuss with him how you feel he is ignoring the Clubs needs. For all of its flaws, the beauty of the model we have as a club is the ability of the fans to ask direct questions of those in charge.
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Post by paulie on Apr 18, 2018 9:44:34 GMT
Am I missing something here? We’re fan owned and clearly Calvin Hughes has been proved time again he’s been ignoring the help this Club needs. Need to get rid ASAP before he makes another group he’s in charge of. Go and see him at the meeting tonight Matt and discuss with him how you feel he is ignoring the Clubs needs. For all of its flaws, the beauty of the model we have as a club is the ability of the fans to ask direct questions of those in charge. How would we know who he was?
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