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Post by Churton Blue on Mar 26, 2020 14:24:50 GMT
Lets not go on about what may or may not happen and support our club thru this crisis Bring next seasons season ticket sale forward to help keep the club over the crisis Very sorry but that would be the worst thing we could do. Firstly we have no idea when the season will start or how many games there will be and secondly it would just delay going bust till next January or February.
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Post by Hannibal on Mar 26, 2020 14:52:15 GMT
Looks like Simon Grand is retiring this summer. He possibly made that decision after being told he won't be offered a new contract next season. He's been a decent player for us for 2 seasons and scored a few good goals. I expect he could carry on drifting down the pyramid, but maybe he has other plans. Good luck in the future Simon.
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Post by dmcnally on Mar 26, 2020 15:05:55 GMT
Looks like Simon Grand is retiring this summer. He possibly made that decision after being told he won't be offered a new contract next season. He's been a decent player for us for 2 seasons and scored a few good goals. I expect he could carry on drifting down the pyramid, but maybe he has other plans. Good luck in the future Simon. Drifting down the pyramid 😂 he’d get into every team in this league. If he wants to continue, he will be offered a deal.
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Post by gezzer on Mar 26, 2020 15:42:46 GMT
Just seen on BBC that all leagues below National League have had their season curtailed and all results expunged. NL, NLN and NLS will finish their seasons as soon as practically possible.
No promotion or relegation from these lower leagues so looks like Blyth and Bradford PA will stay in NLN.
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Post by Lobster on Mar 26, 2020 15:54:55 GMT
I think the voting system is skewed very much in favour of the National League Premier clubs. They all have one vote each and I think the NLN and NLS have four votes each. The issue could be the promotion places to the EFL. Until the EFL make a decision the National League will be loathe to. There will also be a large number of clubs in the Premier whose player contract end on June 30th unlike NLN and NLS where most will end April 30th. I agree with the selfishness argument. This starts at the top and has a knock on effect to the EFL and National League. The sooner the better the Premier League accept the season is over and goes for PPG to decide things. That way everybody else can do the same. They need to take the financial hit re brodcasting money and look at the big picture. There is no way any club will accept relegation from the Premier League based on PPG. The loss would be £100m for each season they stay relegated. They may accept season is over. The result of the ending is more problematic. Realistically that is the one league where games may possibly get played, as they could all be on tv. Thst brings revenue in. Obvious issue is travel for the away team, and holding at corners! I think the Premier League doesn't dare declare the season null and void. Imagine the ructions from Liverpool fans - they're touchy at the best of times!
At the same time, PPG will lead to legal challenges from the clubs relegated.
As I said, there needs to be some sort of clear guidance on what happens if a season can't be continued, and this needs to be written into whatever clubs sign up to at the start of the season. Something like this could always happen, and leagues should be prepared if it does. Too often in football, the authorities seem to wait for a situation to occur and then decide what to do.
Perhaps the sporting thing for Man City to do, as the only team that could mathematically catch Liverpool, is to admit that they were never going to catch Liverpool and declare that they're happy for the title to be awarded to them. I still think PPG is a better solution, but unless it's formally written into the league's guidance/constitution, you can't really just apply it.
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Post by dmcnally on Mar 26, 2020 15:58:32 GMT
There is no way any club will accept relegation from the Premier League based on PPG. The loss would be £100m for each season they stay relegated. They may accept season is over. The result of the ending is more problematic. Realistically that is the one league where games may possibly get played, as they could all be on tv. Thst brings revenue in. Obvious issue is travel for the away team, and holding at corners! I think the Premier League doesn't dare declare the season null and void. Imagine the ructions from Liverpool fans - they're touchy at the best of times!
At the same time, PPG will lead to legal challenges from the clubs relegated.
As I said, there needs to be some sort of clear guidance on what happens if a season can't be continued, and this needs to be written into whatever clubs sign up to at the start of the season. Something like this could always happen, and leagues should be prepared if it does. Too often in football, the authorities seem to wait for a situation to occur and then decide what to do.
Perhaps the sporting thing for Man City to do, as the only team that could mathematically catch Liverpool, is to admit that they were never going to catch Liverpool and declare that they're happy for the title to be awarded to them. I still think PPG is a better solution, but unless it's formally written into the league's guidance/constitution, you can't really just apply it. www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-7931489/Pep-Guardiola-hails-Man-Citys-rivals-admits-defeat-title-race-despite-having-14-games-left.html
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Post by Churton Blue on Mar 26, 2020 16:55:27 GMT
Just seen on BBC that all leagues below National League have had their season curtailed and all results expunged. NL, NLN and NLS will finish their seasons as soon as practically possible. No promotion or relegation from these lower leagues so looks like Blyth and Bradford PA will stay in NLN. www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52052351Could be very bad news for us. Our player contracts probably end April 30th so could potentially make our financial situation worse if League was to finish in June or July. A lot would depend on if we can claim the 80% towards wages till then. Looks far too risky for NLN and NLS clubs to me. Expunging whole Leagues after 30 odd games does appear a witless decision by the FA and sets a worrying precedent for all other Leagues and even future seasons. The FA have also gone against what the National League wanted by not ending the season. www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52039174
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Post by rcb on Mar 26, 2020 17:24:35 GMT
Just seen on BBC that all leagues below National League have had their season curtailed and all results expunged. NL, NLN and NLS will finish their seasons as soon as practically possible. No promotion or relegation from these lower leagues so looks like Blyth and Bradford PA will stay in NLN. www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52052351Could be very bad news for us. Our player contracts probably end April 30th so could potentially make our financial situation worse if League was to finish in June or July. A lot would depend on if we can claim the 80% towards wages till then. Looks far too risky for NLN and NLS clubs to me. Expunging whole Leagues after 30 odd games does appear a witless decision by the FA and sets a worrying precedent for all other Leagues and even future seasons. The FA have also gone against what the National League wanted by not ending the season. www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52039174Lower down, I see several teams have already secured promotion and that situation is now being declared void. Legal action about to commence. The only winners in such a scenario will be those that avoid relegation, whilst teams who have invested heavily for this season, this is tantamount to a massive fine. imagine the travesty if Chorley and their scum supporters avoid relegation. p.s. In all my years of watching football they are the only club I hate.
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Post by superman on Mar 26, 2020 17:40:52 GMT
Suspect the decision to carry on the season is a requirement to guarantee promotion to EFL, There seems to be no agreed mechanism to implement PPG. Likely that lack of clarity will further impact on finances unless a rescue package is being formulated.
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Post by Churton Blue on Mar 26, 2020 17:44:40 GMT
Suspect the decision to carry on the season is a requirement to guarantee promotion to EFL, There seems to be no agreed mechanism to implement PPG. Likely that lack of clarity will further impact on finances unless a rescue package is being formulated. Totally agree. There is also the knock on effect of promotion and relegation from the Premier League down to League 2.
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Post by gezzer on Mar 26, 2020 17:59:20 GMT
www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52052351Could be very bad news for us. Our player contracts probably end April 30th so could potentially make our financial situation worse if League was to finish in June or July. A lot would depend on if we can claim the 80% towards wages till then. Looks far too risky for NLN and NLS clubs to me. Expunging whole Leagues after 30 odd games does appear a witless decision by the FA and sets a worrying precedent for all other Leagues and even future seasons. The FA have also gone against what the National League wanted by not ending the season. www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52039174 Lower down, I see several teams have already secured promotion and that situation is now being declared void. Legal action about to commence. The only winners in such a scenario will be those that avoid relegation, whilst teams who have invested heavily for this season, this is tantamount to a massive fine. imagine the travesty if Chorley and their scum supporters avoid relegation. p.s. In all my years of watching football they are the only club I hate. Indeed, includes Vauxhall Motors.
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Post by Hannibal on Mar 26, 2020 19:46:09 GMT
He possibly made that decision after being told he won't be offered a new contract next season. He's been a decent player for us for 2 seasons and scored a few good goals. I expect he could carry on drifting down the pyramid, but maybe he has other plans. Good luck in the future Simon. Drifting down the pyramid 😂 he’d get into every team in this league. If he wants to continue, he will be offered a deal. How do you know that?
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Post by glanaber1 on Mar 26, 2020 22:55:36 GMT
Lets not go on about what may or may not happen and support our club thru this crisis Bring next seasons season ticket sale forward to help keep the club over the crisis Very sorry but that would be the worst thing we could do. Firstly we have no idea when the season will start or how many games there will be and secondly it would just delay going bust till next January or February. Hi If you dont want to do that well just donate a couple of hundred instead if you want the club to survive
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Post by prodigal on Mar 27, 2020 1:42:04 GMT
Gobsmacked! Utterly bizarre decision to void all these leagues and maybe the rest too. Why the hell did they just not calculate all promotion,relegation and play-off places based on PPG and then ask the clubs to vote on acceptance as fair? Only the relegated clubs and a few finishing just outside the play-offs would vote against, so most leagues would pass the acceptance at about a 2/1 ratio, and it would also mean that the lower leagues could restructure as planned. Play - offs could be played in June all being well, if not back to PPG.
Surely anything is better than expunging everything, all those goals,debuts,appearances,records etc lost forever, all that money wasted on entering and competing in leagues that didn't bother to have a contingency plan in their constitutions!
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Post by avfo on Mar 27, 2020 18:07:55 GMT
Extract from statement from Nantwich Town FC - 'It’s clearly a difficult and challenging time for everyone throughout the world at this time and there are difficult and disappointing decisions having to be made in all areas of life on a daily basis, though to our knowledge none of the Club’s in our league were consulted as part of this decision making process, as we certainly weren’t.' www.nantwichtownfc.co.uk/club-statement-the-ending-of-the-2019-20-season/Extract from statement from South Shields FC - 'We will write to the FA in the strongest possible terms so they are left in no uncertainty as to our feelings, and will seek to appeal if there is a mechanism to do so. If the response does not satisfy us we will seek legal advice. We will seek clarification over whether, with all of the results of the 2019-20 season now annulled, all fines paid to the FA as a result of players picking up yellow and red cards in those matches will now be reimbursed. We will seek clarification over whether the FA will now refund all tickets bought by supporters for those annulled games. We will seek clarification over whether the FA will reimburse the costs accrued by clubs over the last six months for coach travel to away fixtures, which in our case equates to approximately £20,000.' southshieldsfc.co.uk/club-statement-9/Extract from statement from Rhyl FC - 'Rhyl Football Club have confirmed that a decision will be made on the future of the Club by 5pm on the 8th April.' www.rhylfc.co.uk/news/last-chance-for-rhyl-fcExtract from Q+A with Southport FC Chairman - 'as we stand at present very near to the end of March and some three weeks without football we have had no guidance from the powers that be at the National League as to whether the season is over, or “to be continued…” nor any assistance or guidance as to how we are to pay the staff or expenses with no income coming in. I really do feel for Kings Lynn and York, and clubs like Boston and Altrincham who have invested a lot of money in trying to get into the play offs but quite simply at this time there are things more important than football.' southportfc.net/qa-ian-kyle/
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Post by Lobster on Mar 27, 2020 18:48:47 GMT
South Shields are coming at it from the wrong angle. Fines and red cards have always counted whether the game is cancelled or not, and apply to friendlies too. Otherwise a player could get away with a leg-breaking two-footed tackle on a technicality.
Nantwich's statement is more rational and pertinent.
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Post by avfo on Mar 28, 2020 17:28:28 GMT
Extract from statement issued by Dover Athletic FC chairman - 'Many of you will know I am involved in the governance of the National League so my thoughts on how League matters should be brought to conclusion must remain my own for the time being, but I do intend to speak out when the time is right. All I can say is that I find the staggering self interest being displayed by those who can afford to continue to pursue gain from the season by threatening legal action if they don’t get their own way against good people trying to do their best in unprecedented circumstances disgusting beyond further words.' 'I have been asked to clarify Dover Athletic’s position by those concerned about the future of the Club. Put simply the Club has run out of money, with no income at all and none likely for the foreseeable future. I know some funding is being gathered by some of our loyal supporters (gofundme) for which we are extremely thankful and this will become very important in the months to come.' www.doverathletic.com/news/chairmans-update-on-club-situation/
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Post by banksy on Mar 28, 2020 23:55:40 GMT
It's all very simple really, consult all clubs and see what problems lie ahead in the short term, and make a realistic recommendation based on the overall situation with the majority of clubs.
That, it appears, has not been the case.
The most simplistic version right now seems to be to end the season as we are, with both a financial package, as well as promotion and relegation based on a PPG average, and so we can plan again for next season, whenever that will happen.
To go against the majority of clubs views on this smacks of either complete arrogance or negligence. Why on earth would you go against what the majority have asked for?
The FA have made a huge blunder over the cancellation of the season in the leagues below us. The National League are in danger of becoming a complete embarrassment if they do not lobby for what the majority of their clubs want.
To think that clubs can continue the season at our level, with contracts in mind, and no financial package in place, is just laughable at this level of football.
If they want lots of clubs to die, then well done to the FA and National League, they're about to see that happen. The clubs know what's right, but they are not being listened to.
Unbelievable stuff really.
I'm just thankful that we are a fan owned club who can stand up to this, whilst others don't get a say.
Jeff
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Post by rcb on Mar 29, 2020 2:43:55 GMT
It's all very simple really, consult all clubs and see what problems lie ahead in the short term, and make a realistic recommendation based on the overall situation with the majority of clubs. That, it appears, has not been the case. The most simplistic version right now seems to be to end the season as we are, with both a financial package, as well as promotion and relegation based on a PPG average, and so we can plan again for next season, whenever that will happen. To go against the majority of clubs views on this smacks of either complete arrogance or negligence. Why on earth would you go against what the majority have asked for? The FA have made a huge blunder over the cancellation of the season in the leagues below us. The National League are in danger of becoming a complete embarrassment if they do not lobby for what the majority of their clubs want. To think that clubs can continue the season at our level, with contracts in mind, and no financial package in place, is just laughable at this level of football. If they want lots of clubs to die, then well done to the FA and National League, they're about to see that happen. The clubs know what's right, but they are not being listened to. Unbelievable stuff really. I'm just thankful that we are a fan owned club who can stand up to this, whilst others don't get a say. Jeff Nail on head! A disgraceful outcome which flies in the face of democracy. It is said there are two categories of democracy - direct and representative. Sadly this is neither, as the decision has not involved acting directly on the views of the membership since no views were taken, and the membership cannot have been represented since the decision was not made in accordance with the laws or rules by which the representative bodies are governed, since there are no rules in such regard. As such, the decision has no substance and must be legally challenged. Come on, all clubs, stand up, be heard, and fight for your rights! Come on The FA, it’s not too late to admit you are wrong.
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Post by South Wirral Blue on Mar 29, 2020 11:25:39 GMT
It's all very simple really, consult all clubs and see what problems lie ahead in the short term, and make a realistic recommendation based on the overall situation with the majority of clubs. That, it appears, has not been the case. The most simplistic version right now seems to be to end the season as we are, with both a financial package, as well as promotion and relegation based on a PPG average, and so we can plan again for next season, whenever that will happen. To go against the majority of clubs views on this smacks of either complete arrogance or negligence. Why on earth would you go against what the majority have asked for? The FA have made a huge blunder over the cancellation of the season in the leagues below us. The National League are in danger of becoming a complete embarrassment if they do not lobby for what the majority of their clubs want. To think that clubs can continue the season at our level, with contracts in mind, and no financial package in place, is just laughable at this level of football. If they want lots of clubs to die, then well done to the FA and National League, they're about to see that happen. The clubs know what's right, but they are not being listened to. Unbelievable stuff really. I'm just thankful that we are a fan owned club who can stand up to this, whilst others don't get a say. Jeff Agree. There's several ways in which this could be played out but voiding the whole thing and pretending it never happened is the worst option in my opinion. I know a few 1874 Northwich fans and what's happened to them is so cruel, they were a matter of weeks away from getting out of a league they've been in for years.
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Post by Churton Blue on Mar 29, 2020 11:32:57 GMT
It's all very simple really, consult all clubs and see what problems lie ahead in the short term, and make a realistic recommendation based on the overall situation with the majority of clubs. That, it appears, has not been the case. The most simplistic version right now seems to be to end the season as we are, with both a financial package, as well as promotion and relegation based on a PPG average, and so we can plan again for next season, whenever that will happen. To go against the majority of clubs views on this smacks of either complete arrogance or negligence. Why on earth would you go against what the majority have asked for? The FA have made a huge blunder over the cancellation of the season in the leagues below us. The National League are in danger of becoming a complete embarrassment if they do not lobby for what the majority of their clubs want. To think that clubs can continue the season at our level, with contracts in mind, and no financial package in place, is just laughable at this level of football. If they want lots of clubs to die, then well done to the FA and National League, they're about to see that happen. The clubs know what's right, but they are not being listened to. Unbelievable stuff really. I'm just thankful that we are a fan owned club who can stand up to this, whilst others don't get a say. Jeff Nail on head! A disgraceful outcome which flies in the face of democracy. It is said there are two categories of democracy - direct and representative. Sadly this is neither, as the decision has not involved acting directly on the views of the membership since no views were taken, and the membership cannot have been represented since the decision was not made in accordance with the laws or rules by which the representative bodies are governed, since there are no rules in such regard. As such, the decision has no substance and must be legally challenged. Come on, all clubs, stand up, be heard, and fight for your rights! Come on The FA, it’s not too late to admit you are wrong. Brilliant post from Jeff and some great additional comments from RCB. If anybody goes on to the forums of other clubs it would be great if they could be shared with supporters of those clubs.
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Post by The Swansway on Mar 29, 2020 11:35:01 GMT
Lower down, I see several teams have already secured promotion and that situation is now being declared void. Legal action about to commence. The only winners in such a scenario will be those that avoid relegation, whilst teams who have invested heavily for this season, this is tantamount to a massive fine. imagine the travesty if Chorley and their scum supporters avoid relegation.p.s. In all my years of watching football they are the only club I hate. There's probably a few (deluded) Bury supporters getting a a bit excited too ....
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Post by Lobster on Mar 29, 2020 12:51:07 GMT
I was thinking about Bury earlier. Arguably in an envious position at the moment as the only club who have nothing to think about apart from next season. It's never a good time to go bust, but this was the season to do it!
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Post by waggoner on Mar 29, 2020 16:50:30 GMT
Lower down, I see several teams have already secured promotion and that situation is now being declared void. Legal action about to commence. The only winners in such a scenario will be those that avoid relegation, whilst teams who have invested heavily for this season, this is tantamount to a massive fine. imagine the travesty if Chorley and their scum supporters avoid relegation.p.s. In all my years of watching football they are the only club I hate. There's probably a few (deluded) Bury supporters getting a a bit excited too .... Oh yes some have. Stated that 'because the league season could be voided it means that the season never took place and thus they should be given their place back' There of course would still be a probem/s Dale has still not paid anything off the CVA and not paid any bills at all, PLUS he still cannot give proof of funds. Just a bunch of moaning dreamers
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Post by Harry Lime on Mar 29, 2020 17:02:09 GMT
I wouldn't put money on next season starting on time, never mind how we could finish this one.
I'm starting to believe the only way we could finish this season, is if we don't start the next one until 2021. It appears likely these self distancing restrictions will be in place, in one form or another, until next year. Not sure how games will get played consistently during this period.
That's assuming that all National League clubs are still in business. The FA and National League are placing their clubs at risk by not stopping this now. Each week they delay will cost us about £9k based on our published budget.
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Post by Lobster on Mar 29, 2020 17:16:50 GMT
I wouldn't put money on next season starting on time, never mind how we could finish this one. I'm starting to believe the only way we could finish this season, is if we don't start the next one until 2021. It appears likely these self distancing restrictions will be in place, in one form or another, until next year. Not sure how games will get played consistently during this period. That's assuming that all National League clubs are still in business. The FA and National League are placing their clubs at risk by not stopping this now. Each week they delay will cost us about £9k based on our published budget. I'm thinking the same. It might make more sense to cancel next season and finish this one when it's safe to do so. Obviously that puts a lot of financial strain on clubs, but that's an issue for the government.
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Post by oldsealandroadender on Mar 30, 2020 3:31:22 GMT
I wouldn't put money on next season starting on time, never mind how we could finish this one. I'm starting to believe the only way we could finish this season, is if we don't start the next one until 2021. It appears likely these self distancing restrictions will be in place, in one form or another, until next year. Not sure how games will get played consistently during this period. That's assuming that all National League clubs are still in business. The FA and National League are placing their clubs at risk by not stopping this now. Each week they delay will cost us about £9k based on our published budget. So if the season is cancelled now how do the club's save money? Presumably by laying off all the staff including players. Apart from expecting the government to pay them benefit or whatever, players that are under contract will resort to the law to get some of what they are owed. I know these are unprecedented times but contracts cannot just be cancelled without cost. Player contracts would have to be paid up, cheaper to ask them to accept reduced terms during the crisis until such times as the Premier League and FA do the decent thing with some kind of financial package filtered down so we don't start losing clubs en masse. If we have to lose next season completely in order to finish this season then that would be fair on everyone. There seems to be indecent haste to cancel just now. What difference does it make waiting until the end of April or the end of August or whenever. Nobody's going anywhere!
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Post by Neil Hunt Nonsense Potter on Mar 30, 2020 8:30:21 GMT
The salaried staff should have been furloughed last week, which means the government will pay in grant form the club 80% of their salaries. This would protect the majority of their incomes.
The contract payments are still due though. All the ££ in football and well managed clubs going insolvent all over the place is a travesty.
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Post by Harry Lime on Mar 30, 2020 10:38:19 GMT
I wouldn't put money on next season starting on time, never mind how we could finish this one. I'm starting to believe the only way we could finish this season, is if we don't start the next one until 2021. It appears likely these self distancing restrictions will be in place, in one form or another, until next year. Not sure how games will get played consistently during this period. That's assuming that all National League clubs are still in business. The FA and National League are placing their clubs at risk by not stopping this now. Each week they delay will cost us about £9k based on our published budget. So if the season is cancelled now how do the club's save money? Presumably by laying off all the staff including players. Apart from expecting the government to pay them benefit or whatever, players that are under contract will resort to the law to get some of what they are owed. I know these are unprecedented times but contracts cannot just be cancelled without cost. Player contracts would have to be paid up, cheaper to ask them to accept reduced terms during the crisis until such times as the Premier League and FA do the decent thing with some kind of financial package filtered down so we don't start losing clubs en masses. If we have to lose next season completely in order to finish this season then that would be fair on everyone. There seems to be indecent haste to cancel just now. What difference does it make waiting until the end of April or the end of August or whenever. Nobody's going anywhere! Our players will only be contracted until end April or early May. Normal season end. Most part time clubs will have very few players under contract past then., and they wouldn't kick in until August. Normal season start. Losing a whole season of 23 home games, to be replaced by 5 or 6 games, is hardly going to help clubs survive. All alternatives seem fairly unpalatable really. Maybe cleaner to just void it, and start again. Problem then is, if we don't finish the next one. . .
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Post by dmcnally on Mar 30, 2020 11:09:26 GMT
The salaried staff should have been furloughed last week, which means the government will pay in grant form the club 80% of their salaries. This would protect the majority of their incomes. The contract payments are still due though. All the ££ in football and well managed clubs going insolvent all over the place is a travesty. “The Blues have furloughed the majority of their staff, including players, under the Government's Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme which sees the Government pay 80% of wages. Chester are currently making up the other 20%.” www.cheshire-live.co.uk/sport/football/chester-fc-offer-use-stadium-18005417
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