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Post by spencerwhelanleftpeg on Oct 6, 2017 22:17:14 GMT
With regards the squad builder.
It would be imo a good idea to do what Cheltenham, Wrexham and Lincoln did and provide a total update pretty much on a daily basis.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2017 14:55:33 GMT
Definitely set a target and lets see where we get .i would donate more as. long as it is used for new players only this needs sorting quickly Worked for us and we built a fund of over £55k |
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Post by billyw on Oct 7, 2017 16:06:55 GMT
Definitely set a target and lets see where we get .i would donate more as. long as it is used for new players only this needs sorting quickly Worked for us and we built a fund of over £55k An excellent total but I'm afraid Cestrians are less committed. |
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Post by Sealand Road Veteran on Oct 7, 2017 18:17:01 GMT
Said it many times on here
Paint a skip up in Blue and white, Drive it round all the estates in and around the chester area, get it plugged by the chronicle and Dee 106, get people to chuck a quid in etc
Could take it to broughton, Cheshire oaks, on the town hall.
Get a lot of pound coins in a skip
Make it easy for people to give their money, its not rocket science
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Post by blaconboy on Oct 7, 2017 19:36:48 GMT
Said it many times on here Paint a skip up in Blue and white, Drive it round all the estates in and around the chester area, get it plugged by the chronicle and Dee 106, get people to chuck a quid in etc Could take it to broughton, Cheshire oaks, on the town hall. Get a lot of pound coins in a skip Make it easy for people to give their money, its not rocket science Blacon would only nick it! |
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Post by Imperial on Oct 9, 2017 10:51:23 GMT
I won't give money to a squadbuilder. It strikes me as so incredibly tinpot for a football club to ask for donations to pay for players. I do understand that we're fan owned & that money is tight but ultimately CFC is a business & needs to be run as such. We need to find a way to get people down to the ground & spending their money without just begging IMO.
I do support the club financially, I pay to get in (ST this year), always buy food & drink at the ground & buy a fair bit of merchandise too. I just don't like the idea of throwing money at trying to achieve something that is potentially unsustainable, what's the long term solution? If it goes well, we raise loads of money, get some players in & our form improves then what? Are we gambling that the crowds will increase based on that? It's so uncertain. We should be living within our means & that doesn't include donations.
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Post by Firestick Frank on Oct 9, 2017 11:30:45 GMT
I've said it many times that a "Club Builder" would give people more of an incentive to donate as a lot of people seemed pretty peed off with Burr's handling of the last major appeal.
I do agree with Billy that Wrexham fans "get" fan-ownership more than ours do.
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Post by Lobster on Oct 10, 2017 11:55:18 GMT
The reservation I have with squad builder funds is this:
Assuming NWAS's figure of £450K for the wage budget is correct, imagine we raise, say, £25K. That puts us up to £475K, and let's assume it helps keep us up. Great!
But then we come to next season. Really, the budget needs to go up year-on-year anyway, and it's already been swelled by the £25K we raised. So what happens next season, do we need to raise £25K or more all over again? Can we afford to keep the same players on, with the same wages, if they perform well? Could it create a cycle of always operating above the budget and relying on the fans to cover the balance, and if so, what if the fans get fed up and decide not to?
My current line of thinking is that as a one-off, because I have faith in Bignot and think he's inherited a bit of a stinker, I would donate. But long term, I don't think it's sustainable.
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Post by Imperial on Oct 10, 2017 13:28:23 GMT
Exactly. We need to live within our means not just keep begging the same fans who already put their hands in their pockets time & again for yet more money.
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Post by histsci on Oct 10, 2017 15:28:38 GMT
The reservation I have with squad builder funds is this: Assuming NWAS's figure of £450K for the wage budget is correct, imagine we raise, say, £25K. That puts us up to £475K, and let's assume it helps keep us up. Great! But then we come to next season. Really, the budget needs to go up year-on-year anyway, and it's already been swelled by the £25K we raised. So what happens next season, do we need to raise £25K or more all over again? Can we afford to keep the same players on, with the same wages, if they perform well? Could it create a cycle of always operating above the budget and relying on the fans to cover the balance, and if so, what if the fans get fed up and decide not to? My current line of thinking is that as a one-off, because I have faith in Bignot and think he's inherited a bit of a stinker, I would donate. But long term, I don't think it's sustainable. I agree with all of the above, but I think in this case extra funds are very necessary for Bignot! The club doing through the official squadbuilder funds indicates that lessons have been learned from last time, and it might actually lead to a few more setting up a standing order, which will benefit in the longer term. Having a running total is an absolute must though. I'll be donating next month once I've been paid. |
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Post by billyw on Oct 10, 2017 15:33:30 GMT
Exactly. We need to live within our means not just keep begging the same fans who already put their hands in their pockets time & again for yet more money. We're not just fans though are we. We are owners and if we dont put money into the club to hopefully stay in this league, the future is bleak. I've said many times that fan ownership is great provided you have the fans. We don't have sufficient numbers who are prepared to put their hands in their pockets to support the club, unlike our rivals down the road who donated over £50k earlier this year. I hate to say it but with their commitment, they will succeed as a fan owned club while our natural level, without more support through the turnstiles or donations, will be Conference North at best. |
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Post by kyle on Oct 10, 2017 16:05:05 GMT
It's not as simple as that thought is it?
What this really is, is the board saying "we've messed up (again) and burnt the budget (again) so can you stick your hand in your pocket (again) to bail us out?"
I've donated hundreds of pounds, on top of the other significant expenses of supporting this club. I don't think anyone can be expected to throw more good money after bad
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Post by bing on Oct 10, 2017 16:13:23 GMT
It's not as simple as that thought is it? What this really is, is the board saying "we've messed up (again) and burnt the budget (again) so can you stick your hand in your pocket (again) to bail us out?" I've donated hundreds of pounds, on top of the other significant expenses of supporting this club. I don't think anyone can be expected to throw more good money after bad I personally think it's a case of the Board noticing that it was suggested on Devachat and saying, "Why not? If people want to donate they can do". |
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Post by devadiva on Oct 10, 2017 20:11:22 GMT
It's not as simple as that thought is it? What this really is, is the board saying "we've messed up (again) and burnt the budget (again) so can you stick your hand in your pocket (again) to bail us out?" I've donated hundreds of pounds, on top of the other significant expenses of supporting this club. I don't think anyone can be expected to throw more good money after bad I personally think it's a case of the Board noticing that it was suggested on Devachat and saying, "Why not? If people want to donate they can do". We are owners of this club. Any owner knows you have to speculate to accumulate. What’s wrong with investing in what you own? |
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Post by Imperial on Oct 10, 2017 20:45:05 GMT
Look I’m not saying people shouldn’t donate if they want to & can afford it. I just don’t think it’s a sustainable model to rely on donations, we should be concentrating on getting fans through the turnstiles.
The “we’re the owners” argument doesn’t wash. We’re only the owners in the same way that owning shares in any business makes you an owner, it doesn’t make you liable for ensuring the thing stays afloat!
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Post by chesterken on Oct 10, 2017 21:36:48 GMT
It's not as simple as that thought is it? What this really is, is the board saying "we've messed up (again) and burnt the budget (again) so can you stick your hand in your pocket (again) to bail us out?" I've donated hundreds of pounds, on top of the other significant expenses of supporting this club. I don't think anyone can be expected to throw more good money after bad I have no problem with people stating they are not going to donate but it’s way off the mark to state that people shouldn’t be expected to donate again because that’s a choice for individuals to make themselves, many including myself have and more will follow. |
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Post by billyw on Oct 11, 2017 7:37:52 GMT
Look I’m not saying people shouldn’t donate if they want to & can afford it. I just don’t think it’s a sustainable model to rely on donations, we should be concentrating on getting fans through the turnstiles. The “we’re the owners” argument doesn’t wash. We’re only the owners in the same way that owning shares in any business makes you an owner, it doesn’t make you liable for ensuring the thing stays afloat! Problem solved then- we just need to get more fans through turnstiles. How do we do that though? There is only one way fans will increasecin number and that is by having a successful team so how can we get a successful team? By fans dipping into their pockets to get better players. A vicious circle Unless more people are prepared to support the club financially, our life in this league will be short- lived. We won't discover a Sam Hughes every season. |
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Post by Imperial on Oct 11, 2017 8:15:51 GMT
Look I’m not saying people shouldn’t donate if they want to & can afford it. I just don’t think it’s a sustainable model to rely on donations, we should be concentrating on getting fans through the turnstiles. The “we’re the owners” argument doesn’t wash. We’re only the owners in the same way that owning shares in any business makes you an owner, it doesn’t make you liable for ensuring the thing stays afloat! Problem solved then- we just need to get more fans through turnstiles. How do we do that though? There is only one way fans will increasecin number and that is by having a successful team so how can we get a successful team? By fans dipping into their pockets to get better players. A vicious circle Unless more people are prepared to support the club financially, our life in this league will be short- lived. We won't discover a Sam Hughes every season. Yeah I get it, but what happens if we all donate & performances don't improve? Where does that leave us? Our wage budget is higher than previously with fewer people likely to donate again next time. For me marketing the club is key & we've always been poor at it but Chester doesn't seem to have the same level of community identity that say Liverpool or Manchester does. Maybe it's a cultural thing. |
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Post by agl on Oct 11, 2017 8:19:38 GMT
I won't give money to a squadbuilder. It strikes me as so incredibly tinpot for a football club to ask for donations to pay for players. I do understand that we're fan owned & that money is tight but ultimately CFC is a business & needs to be run as such. We need to find a way to get people down to the ground & spending their money without just begging IMO. I do support the club financially, I pay to get in (ST this year), always buy food & drink at the ground & buy a fair bit of merchandise too. I just don't like the idea of throwing money at trying to achieve something that is potentially unsustainable, what's the long term solution? If it goes well, we raise loads of money, get some players in & our form improves then what? Are we gambling that the crowds will increase based on that? It's so uncertain. We should be living within our means & that doesn't include donations. Your choice of course and recognise that you help the club in other ways but this is way off the mark IMO. Supporting a football club like Chester is nothing like having shares in a business. There's an emotional, non rational attachment. Clubs like ours with no sugar Daddy will always rely on fans dipping into their pockets in times of crisis. Whether you view the current situation as a crisis is your call but at the moment we are staring down the barrel of relegation. I think we need to get our heads round that. So, we can either dig our heels in and blame the board, the current manager, the old manager, Mark Maguire, the pies etc or we can do what we always do...get our wallets out. Throwing good money after bad? Maybe. Unsustainable...not really...that would involve doing something that puts us in debt, not asking fans for extra help. I've said it before but running a football club is not science...mistakes get made, players turn out to be not as good as we thought. Say we raise a bit of extra cash for Bignot and he brings in a forward who turns out to be a crock of sh1t or gets injured. Well, that happens in football. Same reason why I didn't have an issue with the Steve Burr squad builder campaign, which most appear to think was a failure. Yes, it would be great for the club to get a load of dosh in from the commercial side but also think they are doing a decent job on that front already. I respect everyones right not to donate more but ask yourself are we more or less likely to stay up if you throw in a few quid. For me it's a no brainer. |
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Post by billyw on Oct 11, 2017 9:08:48 GMT
I won't give money to a squadbuilder. It strikes me as so incredibly tinpot for a football club to ask for donations to pay for players. I do understand that we're fan owned & that money is tight but ultimately CFC is a business & needs to be run as such. We need to find a way to get people down to the ground & spending their money without just begging IMO. I do support the club financially, I pay to get in (ST this year), always buy food & drink at the ground & buy a fair bit of merchandise too. I just don't like the idea of throwing money at trying to achieve something that is potentially unsustainable, what's the long term solution? If it goes well, we raise loads of money, get some players in & our form improves then what? Are we gambling that the crowds will increase based on that? It's so uncertain. We should be living within our means & that doesn't include donations. Your choice of course and recognise that you help the club in other ways but this is way off the mark IMO. Supporting a football club like Chester is nothing like having shares in a business. There's an emotional, non rational attachment. Clubs like ours with no sugar Daddy will always rely on fans dipping into their pockets in times of crisis. Whether you view the current situation as a crisis is your call but at the moment we are staring down the barrel of relegation. I think we need to get our heads round that. So, we can either dig our heels in and blame the board, the current manager, the old manager, Mark Maguire, the pies etc or we can do what we always do...get our wallets out. Throwing good money after bad? Maybe. Unsustainable...not really...that would involve doing something that puts us in debt, not asking fans for extra help. I've said it before but running a football club is not science...mistakes get made, players turn out to be not as good as we thought. Say we raise a bit of extra cash for Bignot and he brings in a forward who turns out to be a crock of sh1t or gets injured. Well, that happens in football. Same reason why I didn't have an issue with the Steve Burr squad builder campaign, which most appear to think was a failure. Yes, it would be great for the club to get a load of dosh in from the commercial side but also think they are doing a decent job on that front already. I respect everyones right not to donate more but ask yourself are we more or less likely to stay up if you throw in a few quid. For me it's a no brainer. Excellent post. I totally understand people not donating if they really cannot afford to do so but 1200 Cestrians put £15k in Tranmere's kitty on Saturday. How many of them will donate to OUR club or even be at our next home game. We need all fans to show they want a club otherwise those committed supporters who carry out voluntary work or regularly dip into their pockets will one day undoubtedly ask 'why do we bother' and that will mean the club's future will lie in the Evostick or Conference North at best. It's OUR club, do we care enough to save it. |
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Post by Imperial on Oct 11, 2017 9:58:55 GMT
Your choice of course and recognise that you help the club in other ways but this is way off the mark IMO. Supporting a football club like Chester is nothing like having shares in a business. There's an emotional, non rational attachment. Clubs like ours with no sugar Daddy will always rely on fans dipping into their pockets in times of crisis. Whether you view the current situation as a crisis is your call but at the moment we are staring down the barrel of relegation. I think we need to get our heads round that. So, we can either dig our heels in and blame the board, the current manager, the old manager, Mark Maguire, the pies etc or we can do what we always do...get our wallets out. Throwing good money after bad? Maybe. Unsustainable...not really...that would involve doing something that puts us in debt, not asking fans for extra help. I've said it before but running a football club is not science...mistakes get made, players turn out to be not as good as we thought. Say we raise a bit of extra cash for Bignot and he brings in a forward who turns out to be a crock of sh1t or gets injured. Well, that happens in football. Same reason why I didn't have an issue with the Steve Burr squad builder campaign, which most appear to think was a failure. Yes, it would be great for the club to get a load of dosh in from the commercial side but also think they are doing a decent job on that front already. I respect everyones right not to donate more but ask yourself are we more or less likely to stay up if you throw in a few quid. For me it's a no brainer. Excellent post. I totally understand people not donating if they really cannot afford to do so but 1200 Cestrians put £15k in Tranmere's kitty on Saturday. How many of them will donate to OUR club or even be at our next home game. We need all fans to show they want a club otherwise those committed supporters who carry out voluntary work or regularly dip into their pockets will one day undoubtedly ask 'why do we bother' and that will mean the club's future will lie in the Evostick or Conference North at best. It's OUR club, do we care enough to save it. I suppose if you honestly see this as a crisis that we require saving from then it's a bit more understandable. But let's be honest, we're not donating to pay off debt or just to keep the club afloat, you're donating to buy more players. Sorry but that isn't a crisis for me & besides the club has reserves. It is unsustainable IMO if we're going to rely on it on a recurring basis. I agree that nothing's nailed on but it just doesn't seem like good business sense not to mention how unprofessional it makes us look. |
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Post by Dodge on Oct 11, 2017 12:14:51 GMT
Excellent post. I totally understand people not donating if they really cannot afford to do so but 1200 Cestrians put £15k in Tranmere's kitty on Saturday. How many of them will donate to OUR club or even be at our next home game. We need all fans to show they want a club otherwise those committed supporters who carry out voluntary work or regularly dip into their pockets will one day undoubtedly ask 'why do we bother' and that will mean the club's future will lie in the Evostick or Conference North at best. It's OUR club, do we care enough to save it. I suppose if you honestly see this as a crisis that we require saving from then it's a bit more understandable. But let's be honest, we're not donating to pay off debt or just to keep the club afloat, you're donating to buy more players. Sorry but that isn't a crisis for me & besides the club has reserves. It is unsustainable IMO if we're going to rely on it on a recurring basis. I agree that nothing's nailed on but it just doesn't seem like good business sense not to mention how unprofessional it makes us look. But what if buying extra players is the difference between survival and relegation? It's an extension on the current playing budget to try and change our fortunes, at the end of the season the playing budget will presumably remain at its current level or reduce, I don't get where people have got the idea that whatever is raised will have to be matched in next season's playing budget? Also I don't understand how it looks unprofessional when Wrexham, Halifax, Macclesfield and Aldershot amongst others have all done it in recent times. |
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Post by Firestick Frank on Oct 11, 2017 12:18:52 GMT
Some people don't fully understand what fan ownership entails.
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Post by Imperial on Oct 11, 2017 14:01:43 GMT
I suppose if you honestly see this as a crisis that we require saving from then it's a bit more understandable. But let's be honest, we're not donating to pay off debt or just to keep the club afloat, you're donating to buy more players. Sorry but that isn't a crisis for me & besides the club has reserves. It is unsustainable IMO if we're going to rely on it on a recurring basis. I agree that nothing's nailed on but it just doesn't seem like good business sense not to mention how unprofessional it makes us look. But what if buying extra players is the difference between survival and relegation? It's an extension on the current playing budget to try and change our fortunes, at the end of the season the playing budget will presumably remain at its current level or reduce, I don't get where people have got the idea that whatever is raised will have to be matched in next season's playing budget? Also I don't understand how it looks unprofessional when Wrexham, Halifax, Macclesfield and Aldershot amongst others have all done it in recent times. But what if it isn't? We could raise & spend this money without achieving anything at all. We're not even at the halfway point yet & we're a long way from being a certainty to go down. Why would the playing budget ever reduce? Surely each season you want to outperform the previous season which is likely to require an increase. If your wage bill is already beyond what you can afford then where do you go from there? The fact that other clubs have done it doesn't mean it's a good idea any more than us having done it before & it not going well (Ben Mills) makes it a bad idea. It's just the idea of a professional football club relying on donations doesn't sit well with me. |
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Post by chesterken on Oct 11, 2017 15:30:54 GMT
But what if buying extra players is the difference between survival and relegation? It's an extension on the current playing budget to try and change our fortunes, at the end of the season the playing budget will presumably remain at its current level or reduce, I don't get where people have got the idea that whatever is raised will have to be matched in next season's playing budget? Also I don't understand how it looks unprofessional when Wrexham, Halifax, Macclesfield and Aldershot amongst others have all done it in recent times. But what if it isn't? We could raise & spend this money without achieving anything at all. We're not even at the halfway point yet & we're a long way from being a certainty to go down. Why would the playing budget ever reduce? Surely each season you want to outperform the previous season which is likely to require an increase. If your wage bill is already beyond what you can afford then where do you go from there? The fact that other clubs have done it doesn't mean it's a good idea any more than us having done it before & it not going well (Ben Mills) makes it a bad idea. It's just the idea of a professional football club relying on donations doesn't sit well with me. It doesn’t have to be a one off signing like Ben we could get a few good quallity lone signings , Woking are doing very nicely with young hungry players. |
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Post by keyboard1 on Oct 14, 2017 16:11:34 GMT
If supporters put their hands in their pockets and raise 25k why can't the club match it out of the rainy day fund
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Post by billyw on Oct 14, 2017 19:19:29 GMT
If supporters put their hands in their pockets and raise 25k why can't the club match it out of the rainy day fund After today, I feel like asking for my donation back as I don't think we are going to raise enough money to make any difference. |
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Post by chesterken on Oct 14, 2017 20:01:39 GMT
If supporters put their hands in their pockets and raise 25k why can't the club match it out of the rainy day fund After today, I feel like asking for my donation back as I don't think we are going to raise enough money to make any difference. Billy after today I feel we need the extra money more than ever; I also gave handsomely last week but I feel it’s our only hope. What really upsets me is that back in the day win lose or draw opposition fans saying Chester were a very good side but now all I hear is that we were crap week after week. |
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Post by Hannibal on Oct 15, 2017 2:57:14 GMT
Said it many times on here Paint a skip up in Blue and white, Drive it round all the estates in and around the chester area, get it plugged by the chronicle and Dee 106, get people to chuck a quid in etc Could take it to broughton, Cheshire oaks, on the town hall. Get a lot of pound coins in a skip Make it easy for people to give their money, its not rocket science We wouldn't even raise enough money to pay for the skip hire. It would lose us money. |
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Post by Charfield Blue on Oct 15, 2017 7:17:27 GMT
I've said since day one that we should have crowd funding for defined infrastructure projects like disabled facilities, bar facilities & stadium improvements. Things that in the long term will provide us with sustainable growth. Whilst i have donated to squad builders in the past, they are no guarantee of success or growth and as such can only frustrate fans, diminishing the likelihood of people putting their hands in their pockets in the future. Let's grow the club through long term defined developments and get the buy in from the fans.
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