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Post by dmcnally on Feb 17, 2017 19:29:21 GMT
Alan. Nobody has questioned your integrity on here so don't start getting your back up. I and a few others HAVE questioned how those 40 in attendance have failed to press you guys over the alarming financial news from Lawrence when it seemed more important to discuss litter and the volume of Cleggy's microphone. Again I had no box available to send messages during the live feed otherwise you would probably all still be there talking about us dipping into the cash reserves Al, Thanks for your reply. I must admit, when we went to the Q&As I was expecting said questions, although Lawrence was also asked several questions about this, and he is the expert, and gave very honest and concise answers. As I've said, we are there to answer questions, so if we were indeed still there doing this, then so be it. I think what we need to be doing collectively is doing all we can to try and reduce the deficit and ensure that in future seasons we are maximising every opportunity for gaining income. I get frustrated when we get a sub 2,000 gate and I would love to see the Harry Mac full, as I say though, we all play a part in pushing the exposure of the club, and the supporter led flag initiative is a start and great exposure too. Please be reassured that we are not being blasé about the situation and we are looking at every opportunity to turn the gates around. Macca gets it, the players get, we just need a few more of our supporters to get it too. Thanks, Alan Hi Alan, you mention your frustration at a sub 2,000 gate. What is the attendance per game we would require to make up for the losses and break-even? Around 2000? |
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Post by Grinch on Feb 17, 2017 19:30:55 GMT
Don't slate the board you might get a lawsuit from Brian Burns just like one of our biggest fans Mike Griffiths did
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Post by cfc1885 on Feb 17, 2017 19:59:56 GMT
All, I respect everybody's right to have an opinion, I hope you all allow me the right to reply. As a board, we take pride in our transparency and openness to the membership; we are the only club that provides online streaming too. Laurence laid out the reality of the situation in a clear and concise manner that some may have glossed over, that is the approach we wish to take. Now, if I had the answer right this moment as to why our gates were down, we would have 5,000 people in every week. So, in the last two months as Chair I have engaged in every way possible to try and open up our football club to everybody. Despite opinion, the feedback from the young teams who attended on Saturday was incredibly positive. From that, we can see that key to these youngsters enjoying a visit to the game is how we make it memorable, so hopefully the inclusion of the Foot Golf and Streetwise Soccer activities helped. As has been alluded too, we have publicly advertised for two new members to be co-opted to the board; the two roles specifically mentioned are membership and fundraising. This was also clearly mentioned tonight and on Monday the board are all attending a strategic meeting as to how we start actioning these and getting the process moving. As for the questions tonight, I can only answer what I am asked. The live stream allows ALL members to send in their questions via email or Twitter; this is managed live by Neil Bellis. I asked a few times if we had any questions from those watching online. Guess how many we got? 0. Earlier this month, Mark Maguire and I sat down for a live Twitter Q&A, which was open to ALL supporters, CFU members or otherwise. Guess how many questions we had? 10. The board are not blind to the challenges ahead, but by being open about it, we hope to engage supporters more and more. I post on here, I have my email address and Twitter handle in my signature and all other board members' details can be found on the CFU website. We also have the fans@ address and I am open to meeting anybody face-to-face to address their concerns or questions. The point I am trying to make is that we can't do it all ourselves. There is a collective effort needed from everybody to help us grow our message. Sure, we can make the decisions and we can implement the ideas, but everybody can play their part. For years, the website has been lambasted and criticism aimed at Blues Live for just being an opportunity to drain more money out of supporters. We have listened to this, and as Jonny Hughes presented tonight, we will be providing so many FREE services next season. Surely, these are new and exciting opportunities for us to engage with new, current and non-supporters. Is this organic way of growing our supporter base worthy of some positivity? We are where are, and it's been no different since day one, as the figures show, but what we need is all supporters, owners and non-owners to get behind us and support what we are trying to do. We are all passionate individuals who all bleed blue and white. We get no financial gain from doing this; instead we get to give up time with our families to do the best we can to make sure we have a football club. If there is anybody who believes that they can have a positive input on the board, then I implore you to email Marion Needham on marion.needham@chesterfc.com with your interest for co-option. On another point, I actually stuck up for Deva Chat tonight, but that was about 10 minutes before I saw some the comments written down on this very thread. I will continue to give everything for this football club, and I don't mind being criticised for doing something wrong, hell, I would come out personally and put my hands up to it, but I not do at the cost of having my integrity and passion for this amazing football club questioned. Many thanks, Alan You're exactly what this clubs been missing the last 3 years, someone with abit ot passion And communicates with the fans! Lets get behind the blues UTS |
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Post by Paul Da Part on Feb 17, 2017 20:10:52 GMT
Don't slate the board you might get a lawsuit from Brian Burns just like one of our biggest fans Mike Griffiths did Out of interest, is he still on the board? |
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Post by Charfield Blue on Feb 17, 2017 20:13:01 GMT
All, I respect everybody's right to have an opinion, I hope you all allow me the right to reply. As a board, we take pride in our transparency and openness to the membership; we are the only club that provides online streaming too. Laurence laid out the reality of the situation in a clear and concise manner that some may have glossed over, that is the approach we wish to take. Now, if I had the answer right this moment as to why our gates were down, we would have 5,000 people in every week. So, in the last two months as Chair I have engaged in every way possible to try and open up our football club to everybody. Despite opinion, the feedback from the young teams who attended on Saturday was incredibly positive. From that, we can see that key to these youngsters enjoying a visit to the game is how we make it memorable, so hopefully the inclusion of the Foot Golf and Streetwise Soccer activities helped. As has been alluded too, we have publicly advertised for two new members to be co-opted to the board; the two roles specifically mentioned are membership and fundraising. This was also clearly mentioned tonight and on Monday the board are all attending a strategic meeting as to how we start actioning these and getting the process moving. As for the questions tonight, I can only answer what I am asked. The live stream allows ALL members to send in their questions via email or Twitter; this is managed live by Neil Bellis. I asked a few times if we had any questions from those watching online. Guess how many we got? 0. Earlier this month, Mark Maguire and I sat down for a live Twitter Q&A, which was open to ALL supporters, CFU members or otherwise. Guess how many questions we had? 10. The board are not blind to the challenges ahead, but by being open about it, we hope to engage supporters more and more. I post on here, I have my email address and Twitter handle in my signature and all other board members' details can be found on the CFU website. We also have the fans@ address and I am open to meeting anybody face-to-face to address their concerns or questions. The point I am trying to make is that we can't do it all ourselves. There is a collective effort needed from everybody to help us grow our message. Sure, we can make the decisions and we can implement the ideas, but everybody can play their part. For years, the website has been lambasted and criticism aimed at Blues Live for just being an opportunity to drain more money out of supporters. We have listened to this, and as Jonny Hughes presented tonight, we will be providing so many FREE services next season. Surely, these are new and exciting opportunities for us to engage with new, current and non-supporters. Is this organic way of growing our supporter base worthy of some positivity? We are where are, and it's been no different since day one, as the figures show, but what we need is all supporters, owners and non-owners to get behind us and support what we are trying to do. We are all passionate individuals who all bleed blue and white. We get no financial gain from doing this; instead we get to give up time with our families to do the best we can to make sure we have a football club. If there is anybody who believes that they can have a positive input on the board, then I implore you to email Marion Needham on marion.needham@chesterfc.com with your interest for co-option. On another point, I actually stuck up for Deva Chat tonight, but that was about 10 minutes before I saw some the comments written down on this very thread. I will continue to give everything for this football club, and I don't mind being criticised for doing something wrong, hell, I would come out personally and put my hands up to it, but I not do at the cost of having my integrity and passion for this amazing football club questioned. Many thanks, Alan You're exactly what this clubs been missing the last 3 years, someone with abit ot passion And communicates with the fans! Lets get behind the blues UTS He's a great communicator which is what the role requires. It also requires great positivity and the ability to motivate others as well as himself. I hope his skin is thick enough, he'll need it. |
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Post by Grinch on Feb 17, 2017 20:20:05 GMT
Don't slate the board you might get a lawsuit from Brian Burns just like one of our biggest fans Mike Griffiths did Out of interest, is he still on the board? Yes far as i'm aware he is i got a letter from the previous chairman that i'm banned from entering the lookers stadium due to challenging him and Tracey Smith on there roles |
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Post by Paul Da Part on Feb 17, 2017 20:37:53 GMT
Out of interest, is he still on the board? Yes far as i'm aware he is i got a letter from the previous chairman that i'm banned from entering the lookers stadium due to challenging him and Tracey Smith on there roles Really? How can they impose a ban on you simply for having an opinion? It was that attitude in the last three years which caused many of the fanbase to be disillusioned with the club. Thankfully, strides are being made on and off the pitch these days and there is definitely more of a "feel good" factor around the club these days. We are a fan owned club at the end of the day too, so we need every bit of support that we can get, not turn it away. |
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Post by cfc1885 on Feb 17, 2017 21:05:08 GMT
At the end of the day if we want this club to succeed and to achive our dream (10 year plan to get back into the FL) then we must stick together! This means everyone going to games because at the end of the day if people stay away due to 'poor performences' that'll only mean the club gain less money because the cluh survive off the gates due to being fan owned, we need to back the players board etc as much as we can, one thing i've noticed recently and i'm made up its changed is the comunication with the club and the fans its starting to feel like a fan owned club again. What people forget is we have something special here at chester we're not like any other football club we're different and thats why we should all get behind OUR team thick and thin! What the club needs to do is advertise in town , do promotion ticket sale offers and work on the social media side (EG Facebook page). If you can get anybody down to come and watch the blues then please do, dont stay away because at the end of the day it will only affect the club
COME ON YOU SEALS
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Post by sealandender on Feb 17, 2017 21:15:08 GMT
At the end of the day if we want this club to succeed and to achive our dream (10 year plan to get back into the FL) then we must stick together! This means everyone going to games because at the end of the day if people stay away due to 'poor performences' that'll only mean the club gain less money because the cluh survive off the gates due to being fan owned, we need to back the players board etc as much as we can, one thing i've noticed recently and i'm made up its changed is the comunication with the club and the fans its starting to feel like a fan owned club again. What people forget is we have something special here at chester we're not like any other football club we're different and thats why we should all get behind OUR team thick and thin! What the club needs to do is advertise in town , do promotion ticket sale offers and work on the social media side (EG Facebook page). If you can get anybody down to come and watch the blues then please do, dont stay away because at the end of the day it will only affect the club COME ON YOU SEALS just to add to that post. if you cant get to many games . join the blues lottery . it all helps .. COYB |
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Post by poolepirate on Feb 17, 2017 21:19:33 GMT
did our CEO not say a few weeks ago that we were only a few thousand under budget ?
since then we have 2 games on bt sport(£7000 per game)and another sponser(from saugall if i remember rightlity)
this income was surely not in the budget plans ?
when is the financial year end for the club ?
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Alan
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Post by Alan on Feb 17, 2017 21:19:47 GMT
Good evening all,
Well, there's definitely been a lot to read through.
What have I taken from this topic? The main thing is the passion we all have for our football club. Whether we agree or disagree with each other, we can all agree that we want the very best for Chester Football Club. The key for me though is that we all need to stop looking back and what has happened and what could or should have happened, and deal with what we have now. In my experience, if we can't get over the past, we can't look to the future. What we can do though is learn from it.
I personally think an open fans' forum is an excellent idea and something that will be explored to being set up. My hope is that it will attract supporters of all opinions. CFU members, non-CFU members, season ticket holders etc etc. As Chair of the CFU it is my role to ensure the board are acting in the best interests of the members and the football club, hopefully the more open we can be, the more of those who may have previously felt down will look at giving things a second chance. Re-join the CFU, become a season ticket holder, just get a couple of games in. Every single pound generated helps us progress.
The very point of Laurence speaking so candidly last night, was our way of showing we have nothing to hide and bringing to the forefront our limitations. The situation is what it is and we need to work to making sure we turn this into a positive. In a perverse way, last night's figures appear to have almost re-ignited people into thinking what we need to be doing, the key now is to work out how we get there; this has got to be a collective effort. It won't happen tomorrow, but you can bet your damnedest that myself and the board, working alongside others like Mark Maguire and Jim Green, are going to do our hardest to get people through the turnstiles, engage even more with the public and make sure our physical presence across the borough continues as it has over the last 5 months.
We have an exciting new web presence launching next season, which allow us greater control of how we image ourselves, and hopefully bringing Blues Live out from behind a subscription is a huge positive. We will have highlights online, greater interaction with Macca and the players. Whilst the board concentrate on pushing us forward, the players too will continue to play their part.
What we absolutely need now is unity and co-operation. We will need to sometimes make tough decisions, but there will also be the good times too. We have something very good at the moment on the pitch and hopefully supporters are also starting to feel more part of what we are doing. I will continue to be contactable and I am open to speaking to anybody who wishes to do so.
Despite how it may look now, we still have our destiny in our hands, we all play a part in how we grow ourselves. We can all share fixtures through our social media pages, we can ask friends down for a game. It's not all about being a volunteer or a Director, because sometimes the small things can be just as important too.
In conclusion, give me the model we have now, any day of the week. We owe nothing to anybody and let's work together to do our best to keep it that way.
Thanks,
Alan
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Post by richard on Feb 17, 2017 21:25:55 GMT
Good evening all, Well, there's definitely been a lot to read through. What have I taken from this topic? The main thing is the passion we all have for our football club. Whether we agree or disagree with each other, we can all agree that we want the very best for Chester Football Club. The key for me though is that we all need to stop looking back and what has happened and what could or should have happened, and deal with what we have now. In my experience, if we can't get over the past, we can't look to the future. What we can do though is learn from it. I personally think an open fans' forum is an excellent idea and something that will be explored to being set up. My hope is that it will attract supporters of all opinions. CFU members, non-CFU members, season ticket holders etc etc. As Chair of the CFU it is my role to ensure the board are acting in the best interests of the members and the football club, hopefully the more open we can be, the more of those who may have previously felt down will look at giving things a second chance. Re-join the CFU, become a season ticket holder, just get a couple of games in. Every single pound generated helps us progress. The very point of Laurence speaking so candidly last night, was our way of showing we have nothing to hide and bringing to the forefront our limitations. The situation is what it is and we need to work to making sure we turn this into a positive. In a perverse way, last night's figures appear to have almost re-ignited people into thinking what we need to be doing, the key now is to work out how we get there; this has got to be a collective effort. It won't happen tomorrow, but you can bet your damnedest that myself and the board, working alongside others like Mark Maguire and Jim Green, are going to do our hardest to get people through the turnstiles, engage even more with the public and make sure our physical presence across the borough continues as it has over the last 5 months. We have an exciting new web presence launching next season, which allow us greater control of how we image ourselves, and hopefully bringing Blues Live out from behind a subscription is a huge positive. We will have highlights online, greater interaction with Macca and the players. Whilst the board concentrate on pushing us forward, the players too will continue to play their part. What we absolutely need now is unity and co-operation. We will need to sometimes make tough decisions, but there will also be the good times too. We have something very good at the moment on the pitch and hopefully supporters are also starting to feel more part of what we are doing. I will continue to be contactable and I am open to speaking to anybody who wishes to do so. Despite how it may look now, we still have our destiny in our hands, we all play a part in how we grow ourselves. We can all share fixtures through our social media pages, we can ask friends down for a game. It's not all about being a volunteer or a Director, because sometimes the small things can be just as important too. In conclusion, give me the model we have now, any day of the week. We owe nothing to anybody and let's work together to do our best to keep it that way. Thanks, Alan Great post Alan. Looking forward has to be the way. Thanks for taking the time to post |
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Post by durdy on Feb 17, 2017 21:25:56 GMT
I know it's been said above that there's no point talking about what happened in the past but the situation we are in now is, in my opinion, borne out of running before we could walk and spending unnecessarily obscene amounts of money in order to do so in an attempt to match a frankly dangerous target of FL in ten years. Did we really need the likes of Gritton, Proudlock, Trundle? As a club we are still not ready for the Conference. Some of us said it at the time but we're shouted down - we should've gradually built the club up to a position where it can be sustainable because relying on cup runs certainly isn't a sustainable proposition. We failed to take advantage of the feel good factor of the first couple of seasons. I know I've said it many times before but the smack in the face of a price hike 24 hours after Hereford went bust to reprieve our Conference status was a massive kick in the bollocks and pissed a lot of people off. The CT, as I've said elsewhere, are doing superb work with schools and junior teams but it's a shame this wasn't being done when we were smashing teams 6-0. That's been and gone now, but I really feel we've missed our chance. Another year or two to get the infrastructure built up lower down the leagues would've been better. I disagree that crowds would've disappeared had we not bought our way to three titles before we could walk (let's be honest we were no different then to the Salfords and the Fyldes are now other than ownership model). The chance has gone now because we are still punching well above our weight as a club and next season could see over half the division considered as big budget clubs looking at the bottom of League Two and the teams looking likely to come up plus the likes of Sutton's cup money. Staying in the division year on year is an achievement for now, that's how it is. But I really believe it could've been so much more in hindsight had we not blown the budgets and blitzed our way up the leagues. |
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Post by Charfield Blue on Feb 17, 2017 21:48:04 GMT
did our CEO not say a few weeks ago that we were only a few thousand under budget ? since then we have 2 games on bt sport(£7000 per game)and another sponser(from saugall if i remember rightlity) this income was surely not in the budget plans ? when is the financial year end for the club ? 1 home game and 1 away game on BT was in the budget - this was reported by Lawrence last night at the CFU meeting since this is the "standard" that BT advise. Might not pan out like that but it's the safe option. This year we are marginally better off based on this prediction. |
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Post by Paul Da Part on Feb 17, 2017 21:51:56 GMT
I know it's been said above that there's no point talking about what happened in the past but the situation we are in now is, in my opinion, borne out of running before we could walk and spending unnecessarily obscene amounts of money in order to do so in an attempt to match a frankly dangerous target of FL in ten years. Did we really need the likes of Gritton, Proudlock, Trundle? As a club we are still not ready for the Conference. Some of us said it at the time but we're shouted down - we should've gradually built the club up to a position where it can be sustainable because relying on cup runs certainly isn't a sustainable proposition. We failed to take advantage of the feel good factor of the first couple of seasons. I know I've said it many times before but the smack in the face of a price hike 24 hours after Hereford went bust to reprieve our Conference status was a massive kick in the bollocks and pissed a lot of people off. The CT, as I've said elsewhere, are doing superb work with schools and junior teams but it's a shame this wasn't being done when we were smashing teams 6-0. That's been and gone now, but I really feel we've missed our chance. Another year or two to get the infrastructure built up lower down the leagues would've been better. I disagree that crowds would've disappeared had we not bought our way to three titles before we could walk (let's be honest we were no different then to the Salfords and the Fyldes are now other than ownership model). The chance has gone now because we are still punching well above our weight as a club and next season could see over half the division considered as big budget clubs looking at the bottom of League Two and the teams looking likely to come up plus the likes of Sutton's cup money. Staying in the division year on year is an achievement for now, that's how it is. But I really believe it could've been so much more in hindsight had we not blown the budgets and blitzed our way up the leagues. Brilliant post, this. I agree with everything said in this post. But we could agonise over what we've done wrong in the past, but what's done is done unfortunately. We blew our chance to build the fan base during our early, successful years. We never capitalised on the 5009 vs Northwich, the 3,500 vs Nantwich, nor the regular 2,500+ attendances we attracted in the early days of our club. It's a shame, but again, what's done is done. Also, the money that Neil Young was allowed to spend in that time (while, admittedly, we enjoyed the success it brought) in hindsight was a little silly. There were players getting paid when they played, and the turnover of players was a little ridiculous too. Still, what's done is done and we are where we are. |
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Post by Chester_Blue on Feb 17, 2017 21:53:16 GMT
Alan cheers for taking time out and replying to both boards this is what the club have been missing for years we fans may agree / disagree with you from time to time but your input is valuable to our club
keep up the good work
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Post by Quaker on Feb 17, 2017 22:33:07 GMT
I understand with our model it has certain limitations but why is everything always so negative. We all as supporters also need enthusing but all I seem to hear is negativity. We need to be sustainable ( yes we do) we will be happy being 6 the from bottom ( no we shouldn't) the budget only allows a small squad etc etc.
if this is the case what are we doing about it. What is the plan for the football side of the business because if we carry on year on year losing are best players who if I'm reading the model correct are usually the younger ones who may demand a fee as they continue to develop.
We recruit players from lower down or those released from clubs who are scouting these players because ultimately that is the market we need to be in primarily as the well known players will be out of our league wages wise.
If we continue as we are without a plan and continually accepting that we should be happy just staying in the league we will eventually be relegated and the Conference North with only one up is a difficult league.
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Post by cfcforme on Feb 17, 2017 22:33:39 GMT
Can anyone confirm what was discussed about the website / blues live last night please? I assume we'll get a new website but will it be a template job like the current one again out a custom design? Cheers
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Alan
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Post by Alan on Feb 17, 2017 22:49:05 GMT
Can anyone confirm what was discussed about the website / blues live last night please? I assume we'll get a new website but will it be a template job like the current one again out a custom design? Cheers Hi cfcforme, So, for the new website we will be under no constraints or contract and we will have full control over the look and content. We will be using Wordpress as a template because the most important thing is to ensure that we future proof ourselves. The ease of use with with which Wordpress brings us, will hopefully allow us to continue to have a clear brand image for years to come. Also, the CFU website, the new commercial website and the Community Trust website will also be under the same template, so there is a clear and professional image to help publicise the club further. Blues Live and the new Chester FC TV can also be integrated in, so it becomes a one stop place for all things Chester FC. Thanks, Alan |
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Alan
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Post by Alan on Feb 17, 2017 22:51:34 GMT
I understand with our model it has certain limitations but why is everything always so negative. We all as supporters also need enthusing but all I seem to hear is negativity. We need to be sustainable ( yes we do) we will be happy being 6 the from bottom ( no we shouldn't) the budget only allows a small squad etc etc. if this is the case what are we doing about it. What is the plan for the football side of the business because if we carry on year on year losing are best players who if I'm reading the model correct are usually the younger ones who may demand a fee as they continue to develop. We recruit players from lower down or those released from clubs who are scouting these players because ultimately that is the market we need to be in primarily as the well known players will be out of our league wages wise. If we continue as we are without a plan and continually accepting that we should be happy just staying in the league we will eventually be relegated and the Conference North with only one up is a difficult league. Hi Quaker, No negativity from me, I only see a positive and bright future for our football club. It will take time and it will need us to be sensible, but we will get there, we just need to smart about how we do it. Thanks, Alan |
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Post by Season Ticket Holder, on Feb 17, 2017 22:59:23 GMT
I think the majority of Chester F.C. Supporters are quietly happy the way our club is run and managed but the annoying bit is the so called whinging,whining bunch who at every opportunity want to be negative . There are 2 options open to us all , support our club the best you can or follow someone else. The reports after each match tell you the number of supporters but never mentions the non supporters........ because non supporters are always invisible but make a lot of noise.
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Post by 1paulcarden on Feb 17, 2017 23:28:33 GMT
I think the majority of Chester F.C. Supporters are quietly happy the way our club is run and managed but the annoying bit is the so called whinging,whining bunch who at every opportunity want to be negative . There are 2 options open to us all , support our club the best you can or follow someone else. The reports after each match tell you the number of supporters but never mentions the non supporters........ because non supporters are always invisible but make a lot of noise. I'd agree with a fair bit of this. If someone had offered an outside push at the playoffs in the Conference being fan owned and no debt 6 years ago (or whenever it was when Vaughan shafted us) we would've all laughed and snapped their hand off. Christ, we can get pretty hysterical. |
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Post by Duke on Feb 17, 2017 23:41:55 GMT
I know it's been said above that there's no point talking about what happened in the past but the situation we are in now is, in my opinion, borne out of running before we could walk and spending unnecessarily obscene amounts of money in order to do so in an attempt to match a frankly dangerous target of FL in ten years. Did we really need the likes of Gritton, Proudlock, Trundle? As a club we are still not ready for the Conference. Some of us said it at the time but we're shouted down - we should've gradually built the club up to a position where it can be sustainable because relying on cup runs certainly isn't a sustainable proposition. We failed to take advantage of the feel good factor of the first couple of seasons. I know I've said it many times before but the smack in the face of a price hike 24 hours after Hereford went bust to reprieve our Conference status was a massive kick in the bollocks and pissed a lot of people off. The CT, as I've said elsewhere, are doing superb work with schools and junior teams but it's a shame this wasn't being done when we were smashing teams 6-0. That's been and gone now, but I really feel we've missed our chance. Another year or two to get the infrastructure built up lower down the leagues would've been better. I disagree that crowds would've disappeared had we not bought our way to three titles before we could walk (let's be honest we were no different then to the Salfords and the Fyldes are now other than ownership model). The chance has gone now because we are still punching well above our weight as a club and next season could see over half the division considered as big budget clubs looking at the bottom of League Two and the teams looking likely to come up plus the likes of Sutton's cup money. Staying in the division year on year is an achievement for now, that's how it is. But I really believe it could've been so much more in hindsight had we not blown the budgets and blitzed our way up the leagues. |
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Post by banksy on Feb 18, 2017 1:16:06 GMT
It didn't take long for you to come on here and try and get your post count up did it Mancot?
To put the record straight about your claim that 'obscene amounts of money' were spent in the early years, let me just say that you are so far off the mark on this claim. Yes, the playing budget may have been exceeded now and then, but it was always in control. Let me give you an example. Matty McGinn. The board decided to extend the playing budget one year to accommodate the permanent signing of Matty, following a successful loan spell at the club. The manager was then told that he'd have to release some players to balance up the playing budget. Matty scored the goal that clinched the championship for us, so I could say that that was a justified move.
Some players signed don't always work out, and are subsequently released (as you refer to Trundle etc - however, the player may actually not be on as much as you may believe given they maybe a free agent etc. So, very low risk.
There was of course an issue that revolved around the previous bar manager at the club that did hurt us in the year that we made a significant loss. This being in the same year that we'd also given then go ahead for the Legends Lounge refurb - that was required as we were having to turn businesses away due to the lack of room in there at the time - this has now paid for itself which was always the intention and end goal. Funnily enough I know you claim that the LL is an 'elite' which is an amazing claim given I've seen yourself and colleagues in there, and there is definitely no 'elite' or 'us and them' situation at the club. We're all fans at the same level at the end of the day. Some have more money than others and choose to spend it on a LL season ticket, (others like myself would end up in the Blues Bar). I have no problem with anyone frequenting the LL that has paid for the privilege.
To suggest that we bought three titles is simply insulting to those that made it happen. Skelmersdale in the first year kept us oh so nervous that day in Garforth, and if Northwich hadn't imploded then I'm sure we would have been pushed all the way in that season too. I simply believe momentum took care of the Conference North, but let's not forget we were in about 6th or 7th position going into November in that league I think!
Chester FC is a fan owned club - have you renewed your membership yet? It would be nice to know you'd put your money where your mouth is for the 2016/17 registration. Considering you bang on so much about fan involvement and this being a community club, I sincerely hope you have paid the £12 to help boost the membership that you are constantly sniping at having a low figure on.
I think we're at a point no where each fan should ask themselves, is there anything I can do to help my club. Take a look at what Danny McNally has done, he's taking the lack of atmosphere on the Harry Mac terrace by the scruff of the neck and trying (successfully) to raise funds to help do something positive - good on him. I only hope others come forward and offer their support to him and other areas that need improvement instead of moaning about what we haven't done. I've sent a few ideas in to the CFU chairman this week to see if they believe they would be good ideas to implement - if they are great, they could help the club raise over £60k in one concerted effort, if not a great idea for any reason whatsoever then I'll try and think of others. Better to have tried than not tried at all.
We don't have a sugar daddy, neither would most of us want one given our past. yes, we'd all love to see our club flush with money, but let's try and do it the honest way, and not one that will see our club fold again.
We all have a job to do as Chester fans whether we like it or not, it's in our blood, so why not spread that feeling onto others, rope them in, get them signed up as a Chester FC owner, get them down on matchdays - of course it costs £16/£18 to attend, but that's the average for this league. Premier League & Football League have one reason why they can throw so much advertising and special offers to fans during the course of the season...TV money. That's something that we clearly haven't enjoyed the luxury of at our level. I'm sure the £10 terrace would be tried out if we could rely on TV money to cover the risk element of that idea.
It was mentioned last night that the police bill for the Wrexham home game was £7k - so that's the live TV appearance money on BT Sport wiped out in one hit, same for the Tranmere game, which again wipes out the £7k tv fee - what a great shame that is.
So, for those sniping, think about the reasons behind why the club haven't done this and haven't done that (they have more than likely been given a serious amount of thought but may have turned out to be unworkable/impractical and haven't been implemented), and always keep trying to think of ideas to push the club forward.
We're all Chester fans at the end of the day, aren't we?
Banksy
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Post by agl on Feb 18, 2017 1:19:21 GMT
I know it's been said above that there's no point talking about what happened in the past but the situation we are in now is, in my opinion, borne out of running before we could walk and spending unnecessarily obscene amounts of money in order to do so in an attempt to match a frankly dangerous target of FL in ten years. Did we really need the likes of Gritton, Proudlock, Trundle? As a club we are still not ready for the Conference. Some of us said it at the time but we're shouted down - we should've gradually built the club up to a position where it can be sustainable because relying on cup runs certainly isn't a sustainable proposition. We failed to take advantage of the feel good factor of the first couple of seasons. I know I've said it many times before but the smack in the face of a price hike 24 hours after Hereford went bust to reprieve our Conference status was a massive kick in the bollocks and pissed a lot of people off. The CT, as I've said elsewhere, are doing superb work with schools and junior teams but it's a shame this wasn't being done when we were smashing teams 6-0. That's been and gone now, but I really feel we've missed our chance. Another year or two to get the infrastructure built up lower down the leagues would've been better. I disagree that crowds would've disappeared had we not bought our way to three titles before we could walk (let's be honest we were no different then to the Salfords and the Fyldes are now other than ownership model). The chance has gone now because we are still punching well above our weight as a club and next season could see over half the division considered as big budget clubs looking at the bottom of League Two and the teams looking likely to come up plus the likes of Sutton's cup money. Staying in the division year on year is an achievement for now, that's how it is. But I really believe it could've been so much more in hindsight had we not blown the budgets and blitzed our way up the leagues. Brilliant post, this. I agree with everything said in this post. But we could agonise over what we've done wrong in the past, but what's done is done unfortunately. We blew our chance to build the fan base during our early, successful years. We never capitalised on the 5009 vs Northwich, the 3,500 vs Nantwich, nor the regular 2,500+ attendances we attracted in the early days of our club. It's a shame, but again, what's done is done. Also, the money that Neil Young was allowed to spend in that time (while, admittedly, we enjoyed the success it brought) in hindsight was a little silly. There were players getting paid when they played, and the turnover of players was a little ridiculous too. Still, what's done is done and we are where we are. So you really think that if we were languishing in Evostik Premier, while we built these supposed foundations that crowds would have held up? It was exactly the right policy to get as high up the leagues as possible while riding on the feelgod factor. No one should ever denigrate what we achieved in those first three seasons. Ask Stockport. With the benefit of hindsight it's easy to say we spent too much but winning leagues is not an exact science. I don't recall too many complaints at the time. The problem is that we've now found our level and it's difficult to attract people to watch a team trying to punch above its weight and losing games. Funny how all this nonsense goes into meltdown when we are on a bad run then goes quiet when we win a few. I suspect the silent majority actually get it and buy into what's going on behind the scenes but tend to get drowned out by the usual suspects who spend too much time on their keyboards. There's a danger they will suck the life out of the club with their unrelenting negativity and backwards looking approach. I hope the current chairman doesn't think three or four posters on here speak for the fan base. |
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Post by Pseudoscally on Feb 18, 2017 7:34:19 GMT
It didn't take long for you to come on here and try and get your post count up did it Mancot? To put the record straight about your claim that 'obscene amounts of money' were spent in the early years, let me just say that you are so far off the mark on this claim. Yes, the playing budget may have been exceeded now and then, but it was always in control. Let me give you an example. Matty McGinn. The board decided to extend the playing budget one year to accommodate the permanent signing of Matty, following a successful loan spell at the club. The manager was then told that he'd have to release some players to balance up the playing budget. Matty scored the goal that clinched the championship for us, so I could say that that was a justified move. Some players signed don't always work out, and are subsequently released (as you refer to Trundle etc - however, the player may actually not be on as much as you may believe given they maybe a free agent etc. So, very low risk. There was of course an issue that revolved around the previous bar manager at the club that did hurt us in the year that we made a significant loss. This being in the same year that we'd also given then go ahead for the Legends Lounge refurb - that was required as we were having to turn businesses away due to the lack of room in there at the time - this has now paid for itself which was always the intention and end goal. Funnily enough I know you claim that the LL is an 'elite' which is an amazing claim given I've seen yourself and colleagues in there, and there is definitely no 'elite' or 'us and them' situation at the club. We're all fans at the same level at the end of the day. Some have more money than others and choose to spend it on a LL season ticket, (others like myself would end up in the Blues Bar). I have no problem with anyone frequenting the LL that has paid for the privilege. To suggest that we bought three titles is simply insulting to those that made it happen. Skelmersdale in the first year kept us oh so nervous that day in Garforth, and if Northwich hadn't imploded then I'm sure we would have been pushed all the way in that season too. I simply believe momentum took care of the Conference North, but let's not forget we were in about 6th or 7th position going into November in that league I think! Chester FC is a fan owned club - have you renewed your membership yet? It would be nice to know you'd put your money where your mouth is for the 2016/17 registration. Considering you bang on so much about fan involvement and this being a community club, I sincerely hope you have paid the £12 to help boost the membership that you are constantly sniping at having a low figure on. I think we're at a point no where each fan should ask themselves, is there anything I can do to help my club. Take a look at what Danny McNally has done, he's taking the lack of atmosphere on the Harry Mac terrace by the scruff of the neck and trying (successfully) to raise funds to help do something positive - good on him. I only hope others come forward and offer their support to him and other areas that need improvement instead of moaning about what we haven't done. I've sent a few ideas in to the CFU chairman this week to see if they believe they would be good ideas to implement - if they are great, they could help the club raise over £60k in one concerted effort, if not a great idea for any reason whatsoever then I'll try and think of others. Better to have tried than not tried at all. We don't have a sugar daddy, neither would most of us want one given our past. yes, we'd all love to see our club flush with money, but let's try and do it the honest way, and not one that will see our club fold again. We all have a job to do as Chester fans whether we like it or not, it's in our blood, so why not spread that feeling onto others, rope them in, get them signed up as a Chester FC owner, get them down on matchdays - of course it costs £16/£18 to attend, but that's the average for this league. Premier League & Football League have one reason why they can throw so much advertising and special offers to fans during the course of the season...TV money. That's something that we clearly haven't enjoyed the luxury of at our level. I'm sure the £10 terrace would be tried out if we could rely on TV money to cover the risk element of that idea. It was mentioned last night that the police bill for the Wrexham home game was £7k - so that's the live TV appearance money on BT Sport wiped out in one hit, same for the Tranmere game, which again wipes out the £7k tv fee - what a great shame that is. So, for those sniping, think about the reasons behind why the club haven't done this and haven't done that (they have more than likely been given a serious amount of thought but may have turned out to be unworkable/impractical and haven't been implemented), and always keep trying to think of ideas to push the club forward. We're all Chester fans at the end of the day, aren't we? Banksy
I think that is a complete over reaction to a balanced and well thought out post by Sychdyn Blue.
He's totally correct in looking back at the mistakes made in the early days so we remember and don't keep making them.
Like it or not, spending so much money on a LL make over while nothing has been invested to make the match day experience better for the majority who attend the games, not least our less able fans, will create ill feeling. I'd also like to see figures to see if it actually did pay for itself in the end - I'm not so sure.
If we want things to change then we need to be different and we need to be affordable. £16/18 - although, may be the going rate is not affordable and certainly isn't value for money, especially for the casual fan who maybe in the early days came to 10-15 games a season and now only makes the effort for 5 of the best games. If this means we take a hit financially then so be it, we adjust our budget accordingly. If we have to go backwards, well tough. Look at Burnley, didn't panic when they went down, kept hold of their manager, came straight back up and are much stronger for it.
The club have to be more inclusive to all supports and not just the corporate sponsors. The reality may well be different but the perception is that the prawn sandwich brigade is indeed a closed shop. How about having 10 LL tickets given out to CFU members for each game? Let people see what actually goes on upstairs.
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Post by Al on Feb 18, 2017 8:07:28 GMT
It didn't take long for you to come on here and try and get your post count up did it Mancot? To put the record straight about your claim that 'obscene amounts of money' were spent in the early years, let me just say that you are so far off the mark on this claim. Yes, the playing budget may have been exceeded now and then, but it was always in control. Let me give you an example. Matty McGinn. The board decided to extend the playing budget one year to accommodate the permanent signing of Matty, following a successful loan spell at the club. The manager was then told that he'd have to release some players to balance up the playing budget. Matty scored the goal that clinched the championship for us, so I could say that that was a justified move. Some players signed don't always work out, and are subsequently released (as you refer to Trundle etc - however, the player may actually not be on as much as you may believe given they maybe a free agent etc. So, very low risk. There was of course an issue that revolved around the previous bar manager at the club that did hurt us in the year that we made a significant loss. This being in the same year that we'd also given then go ahead for the Legends Lounge refurb - that was required as we were having to turn businesses away due to the lack of room in there at the time - this has now paid for itself which was always the intention and end goal. Funnily enough I know you claim that the LL is an 'elite' which is an amazing claim given I've seen yourself and colleagues in there, and there is definitely no 'elite' or 'us and them' situation at the club. We're all fans at the same level at the end of the day. Some have more money than others and choose to spend it on a LL season ticket, (others like myself would end up in the Blues Bar). I have no problem with anyone frequenting the LL that has paid for the privilege. To suggest that we bought three titles is simply insulting to those that made it happen. Skelmersdale in the first year kept us oh so nervous that day in Garforth, and if Northwich hadn't imploded then I'm sure we would have been pushed all the way in that season too. I simply believe momentum took care of the Conference North, but let's not forget we were in about 6th or 7th position going into November in that league I think! Chester FC is a fan owned club - have you renewed your membership yet? It would be nice to know you'd put your money where your mouth is for the 2016/17 registration. Considering you bang on so much about fan involvement and this being a community club, I sincerely hope you have paid the £12 to help boost the membership that you are constantly sniping at having a low figure on. I think we're at a point no where each fan should ask themselves, is there anything I can do to help my club. Take a look at what Danny McNally has done, he's taking the lack of atmosphere on the Harry Mac terrace by the scruff of the neck and trying (successfully) to raise funds to help do something positive - good on him. I only hope others come forward and offer their support to him and other areas that need improvement instead of moaning about what we haven't done. I've sent a few ideas in to the CFU chairman this week to see if they believe they would be good ideas to implement - if they are great, they could help the club raise over £60k in one concerted effort, if not a great idea for any reason whatsoever then I'll try and think of others. Better to have tried than not tried at all. We don't have a sugar daddy, neither would most of us want one given our past. yes, we'd all love to see our club flush with money, but let's try and do it the honest way, and not one that will see our club fold again. We all have a job to do as Chester fans whether we like it or not, it's in our blood, so why not spread that feeling onto others, rope them in, get them signed up as a Chester FC owner, get them down on matchdays - of course it costs £16/£18 to attend, but that's the average for this league. Premier League & Football League have one reason why they can throw so much advertising and special offers to fans during the course of the season...TV money. That's something that we clearly haven't enjoyed the luxury of at our level. I'm sure the £10 terrace would be tried out if we could rely on TV money to cover the risk element of that idea. It was mentioned last night that the police bill for the Wrexham home game was £7k - so that's the live TV appearance money on BT Sport wiped out in one hit, same for the Tranmere game, which again wipes out the £7k tv fee - what a great shame that is. So, for those sniping, think about the reasons behind why the club haven't done this and haven't done that (they have more than likely been given a serious amount of thought but may have turned out to be unworkable/impractical and haven't been implemented), and always keep trying to think of ideas to push the club forward. We're all Chester fans at the end of the day, aren't we? Banksy Most of that is drivel. As for blaming the bar manager?? The lad was NEVER charged. As per Tony Durkin's findings. The club lacked the correct financial controls, we overspent on player wages, clubshop stock, paid fees for players that were never needed etc etc. The boom or bust approach was leading us into oblivion off the field. The fact you try and paper over that having another personal pop at a lad who - when trying to make a difference at the club he loves - got publicly slagged off on facebook by you and our former commercial manager. And you wonder why people don't want to stand for election?? |
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Post by Pseudoscally on Feb 18, 2017 8:39:10 GMT
It didn't take long for you to come on here and try and get your post count up did it Mancot? To put the record straight about your claim that 'obscene amounts of money' were spent in the early years, let me just say that you are so far off the mark on this claim. Yes, the playing budget may have been exceeded now and then, but it was always in control. Let me give you an example. Matty McGinn. The board decided to extend the playing budget one year to accommodate the permanent signing of Matty, following a successful loan spell at the club. The manager was then told that he'd have to release some players to balance up the playing budget. Matty scored the goal that clinched the championship for us, so I could say that that was a justified move. Some players signed don't always work out, and are subsequently released (as you refer to Trundle etc - however, the player may actually not be on as much as you may believe given they maybe a free agent etc. So, very low risk. There was of course an issue that revolved around the previous bar manager at the club that did hurt us in the year that we made a significant loss. This being in the same year that we'd also given then go ahead for the Legends Lounge refurb - that was required as we were having to turn businesses away due to the lack of room in there at the time - this has now paid for itself which was always the intention and end goal. Funnily enough I know you claim that the LL is an 'elite' which is an amazing claim given I've seen yourself and colleagues in there, and there is definitely no 'elite' or 'us and them' situation at the club. We're all fans at the same level at the end of the day. Some have more money than others and choose to spend it on a LL season ticket, (others like myself would end up in the Blues Bar). I have no problem with anyone frequenting the LL that has paid for the privilege. To suggest that we bought three titles is simply insulting to those that made it happen. Skelmersdale in the first year kept us oh so nervous that day in Garforth, and if Northwich hadn't imploded then I'm sure we would have been pushed all the way in that season too. I simply believe momentum took care of the Conference North, but let's not forget we were in about 6th or 7th position going into November in that league I think! Chester FC is a fan owned club - have you renewed your membership yet? It would be nice to know you'd put your money where your mouth is for the 2016/17 registration. Considering you bang on so much about fan involvement and this being a community club, I sincerely hope you have paid the £12 to help boost the membership that you are constantly sniping at having a low figure on. I think we're at a point no where each fan should ask themselves, is there anything I can do to help my club. Take a look at what Danny McNally has done, he's taking the lack of atmosphere on the Harry Mac terrace by the scruff of the neck and trying (successfully) to raise funds to help do something positive - good on him. I only hope others come forward and offer their support to him and other areas that need improvement instead of moaning about what we haven't done. I've sent a few ideas in to the CFU chairman this week to see if they believe they would be good ideas to implement - if they are great, they could help the club raise over £60k in one concerted effort, if not a great idea for any reason whatsoever then I'll try and think of others. Better to have tried than not tried at all. We don't have a sugar daddy, neither would most of us want one given our past. yes, we'd all love to see our club flush with money, but let's try and do it the honest way, and not one that will see our club fold again. We all have a job to do as Chester fans whether we like it or not, it's in our blood, so why not spread that feeling onto others, rope them in, get them signed up as a Chester FC owner, get them down on matchdays - of course it costs £16/£18 to attend, but that's the average for this league. Premier League & Football League have one reason why they can throw so much advertising and special offers to fans during the course of the season...TV money. That's something that we clearly haven't enjoyed the luxury of at our level. I'm sure the £10 terrace would be tried out if we could rely on TV money to cover the risk element of that idea. It was mentioned last night that the police bill for the Wrexham home game was £7k - so that's the live TV appearance money on BT Sport wiped out in one hit, same for the Tranmere game, which again wipes out the £7k tv fee - what a great shame that is. So, for those sniping, think about the reasons behind why the club haven't done this and haven't done that (they have more than likely been given a serious amount of thought but may have turned out to be unworkable/impractical and haven't been implemented), and always keep trying to think of ideas to push the club forward. We're all Chester fans at the end of the day, aren't we? Banksy Most of that is drivel. As for blaming the bar manager?? The lad was NEVER charged. As per Tony Durkin's findings. The club lacked the correct financial controls, we overspent on player wages, clubshop stock, paid fees for players that were never needed etc etc. The boom or bust approach was leading us into oblivion off the field. The fact you try and paper over that having another personal pop at a lad who - when trying to make a difference at the club he loves - got publicly slagged off on facebook by you and our former commercial manager. And you wonder why people don't want to stand for election?? Spot on Al. |
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Post by Lobster on Feb 18, 2017 9:19:10 GMT
You could argue it's your duty to do a little more than ask questions. So why don't you ask a few more searching questions of the board and what the plan is to address this issue? Or do you enjoy sitting on that fence of yours?
I care passionately about this club, I still believe in the 100% Fan Owned Football Club for the Community at it's very core.
What I do not have is the time to offer more than I do, with a similar situation to yourself with two very young children, and a busy full time job which could be able to get even busier in the coming weeks.
Does that make my points (or anyone elses for that matter) any less valid? Does that mean my opinion and ideas mean nothing and should be discounted?
If I come across as on the fence, it's because I think there's an important balance to be found between asking questions and respecting that there aren't exactly droves of people willing or able to join the board or volunteer, and if a culture develops of people getting an abrupt ear-bashing all the time, they're soon going to think 'sod it then'. I'm as disappointed as you are about the finances, but I don't think anyone foresaw that we'd really struggle to get 2,000 through the turnstiles this season. Obviously that needs focusing on. Asking questions is well and good, but I'm the sort of person who prefers to suggest answers, and I don't really have any. In truth, I think we're a bit short of ideas, and people to execute them. |
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Post by paulie on Feb 18, 2017 10:00:27 GMT
It didn't take long for you to come on here and try and get your post count up did it Mancot? To put the record straight about your claim that 'obscene amounts of money' were spent in the early years, let me just say that you are so far off the mark on this claim. Yes, the playing budget may have been exceeded now and then, but it was always in control. Let me give you an example. Matty McGinn. The board decided to extend the playing budget one year to accommodate the permanent signing of Matty, following a successful loan spell at the club. The manager was then told that he'd have to release some players to balance up the playing budget. Matty scored the goal that clinched the championship for us, so I could say that that was a justified move. Some players signed don't always work out, and are subsequently released (as you refer to Trundle etc - however, the player may actually not be on as much as you may believe given they maybe a free agent etc. So, very low risk. There was of course an issue that revolved around the previous bar manager at the club that did hurt us in the year that we made a significant loss. This being in the same year that we'd also given then go ahead for the Legends Lounge refurb - that was required as we were having to turn businesses away due to the lack of room in there at the time - this has now paid for itself which was always the intention and end goal. Funnily enough I know you claim that the LL is an 'elite' which is an amazing claim given I've seen yourself and colleagues in there, and there is definitely no 'elite' or 'us and them' situation at the club. We're all fans at the same level at the end of the day. Some have more money than others and choose to spend it on a LL season ticket, (others like myself would end up in the Blues Bar). I have no problem with anyone frequenting the LL that has paid for the privilege. To suggest that we bought three titles is simply insulting to those that made it happen. Skelmersdale in the first year kept us oh so nervous that day in Garforth, and if Northwich hadn't imploded then I'm sure we would have been pushed all the way in that season too. I simply believe momentum took care of the Conference North, but let's not forget we were in about 6th or 7th position going into November in that league I think! Chester FC is a fan owned club - have you renewed your membership yet? It would be nice to know you'd put your money where your mouth is for the 2016/17 registration. Considering you bang on so much about fan involvement and this being a community club, I sincerely hope you have paid the £12 to help boost the membership that you are constantly sniping at having a low figure on. I think we're at a point no where each fan should ask themselves, is there anything I can do to help my club. Take a look at what Danny McNally has done, he's taking the lack of atmosphere on the Harry Mac terrace by the scruff of the neck and trying (successfully) to raise funds to help do something positive - good on him. I only hope others come forward and offer their support to him and other areas that need improvement instead of moaning about what we haven't done. I've sent a few ideas in to the CFU chairman this week to see if they believe they would be good ideas to implement - if they are great, they could help the club raise over £60k in one concerted effort, if not a great idea for any reason whatsoever then I'll try and think of others. Better to have tried than not tried at all. We don't have a sugar daddy, neither would most of us want one given our past. yes, we'd all love to see our club flush with money, but let's try and do it the honest way, and not one that will see our club fold again. We all have a job to do as Chester fans whether we like it or not, it's in our blood, so why not spread that feeling onto others, rope them in, get them signed up as a Chester FC owner, get them down on matchdays - of course it costs £16/£18 to attend, but that's the average for this league. Premier League & Football League have one reason why they can throw so much advertising and special offers to fans during the course of the season...TV money. That's something that we clearly haven't enjoyed the luxury of at our level. I'm sure the £10 terrace would be tried out if we could rely on TV money to cover the risk element of that idea. It was mentioned last night that the police bill for the Wrexham home game was £7k - so that's the live TV appearance money on BT Sport wiped out in one hit, same for the Tranmere game, which again wipes out the £7k tv fee - what a great shame that is. So, for those sniping, think about the reasons behind why the club haven't done this and haven't done that (they have more than likely been given a serious amount of thought but may have turned out to be unworkable/impractical and haven't been implemented), and always keep trying to think of ideas to push the club forward. We're all Chester fans at the end of the day, aren't we? Banksy Quite amusing you decided to pick up on mancots posts. He may have a different opinion to you, but the lad was prepared to show his commitment and run for election. Yourself and that odious harridan Tracey wainwright then decided amongst yourselves to berate and stir up negativity via social media to ruin his election campaign. You should be ashamed of yourself, we're all Chester fans at the end of the day, aren't we? |
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