|
Post by eltonblues on Mar 18, 2018 15:20:37 GMT
Not looking at the two sides debating whether it will or won't happen but if we decided to move away from fan ownership and return it to an investor backed club how would that process happen?
|
|
|
Post by 1967blue Chester Lads on Mar 18, 2018 15:26:41 GMT
Not looking at the two sides debating whether it will or won't happen but if we decided to move away from fan ownership and return it to an investor backed club how would that process happen? Hopefully easy as fan owned club clearly doesn't work.
|
|
|
Post by billyw on Mar 18, 2018 16:09:30 GMT
Not looking at the two sides debating whether it will or won't happen but if we decided to move away from fan ownership and return it to an investor backed club how would that process happen? Hopefully easy as fan owned club clearly doesn't work. Not with our fanbase.
|
|
|
Post by lookingin on Mar 18, 2018 16:54:03 GMT
When we are in the the bottom 4 next season at Christmas. It shouldn't take long.
|
|
|
Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Mar 18, 2018 17:11:22 GMT
A resolution is proposed by one CFU member, it needs the backing of a percentage of the membership to be formally put forward then, if successful, it goes to a vote for the wider CFU membership, to answer the question simply.
For the record I'd vote against it every time.
|
|
|
Post by rcb on Mar 18, 2018 17:29:36 GMT
I guess that all those who are in favour of continuing as fan owned still attend. Looking at attendances now, I suspect those in favour now number less than a thousand. Isn’t eight years long enough to show the experiment isn’t working? As a matter of interest, if a takeover happened, attendances were regularly 3000, and the club topped the National League, would those who strongly favour the fan owned model refuse to attend or not?
|
|
|
Post by Blockhead on Mar 18, 2018 18:00:40 GMT
I guess that all those who are in favour of continuing as fan owned still attend. Looking at attendances now, I suspect those in favour now number less than a thousand. Isn’t eight years long enough to show the experiment isn’t working? As a matter of interest, if a takeover happened, attendances were regularly 3000, and the club topped the National League, would those who strongly favour the fan owned model refuse to attend or not? I, for one, would no longer support the club. Moving away from fan ownership is the worst thing imaginable for me. Don't think I'd feel morally right attending if the fantastic community asset we have now was destroyed.
|
|
|
Post by billyw on Mar 18, 2018 18:36:19 GMT
I guess that all those who are in favour of continuing as fan owned still attend. Looking at attendances now, I suspect those in favour now number less than a thousand. Isn’t eight years long enough to show the experiment isn’t working? As a matter of interest, if a takeover happened, attendances were regularly 3000, and the club topped the National League, would those who strongly favour the fan owned model refuse to attend or not? I, for one, would no longer support the club. Moving away from fan ownership is the worst thing imaginable for me. Don't think I'd feel morally right attending if the fantastic community asset we have now was destroyed. What's the point of having a 'fantastic community asset' if we don't have a team/club?
|
|
|
Post by richard on Mar 18, 2018 18:38:35 GMT
I guess that all those who are in favour of continuing as fan owned still attend. Looking at attendances now, I suspect those in favour now number less than a thousand. Isn’t eight years long enough to show the experiment isn’t working? As a matter of interest, if a takeover happened, attendances were regularly 3000, and the club topped the National League, would those who strongly favour the fan owned model refuse to attend or not? An interesting question. To be perfectly honest rcb, I would be fundamentally against a change of model. I don't consider the last 8 years to be an experiment. More of a rather steep learning curve. We have clearly failed for the last few seasons, but then so have other clubs in private ownership. We are still around because we have no debt, but as in every business of our type, cash is king and we have to recognise that sustainability has to be at the core of our strategy if we are to survive. That opens a whole debate around ambition, speculation and risk. Will we be able to make ends meet if we don't provide a better first team or we don't enjoy the occasional player sale or cup run? Probably not, so there is much to do and some hard decisions to make.
|
|
|
Post by Blockhead on Mar 18, 2018 19:08:38 GMT
I, for one, would no longer support the club. Moving away from fan ownership is the worst thing imaginable for me. Don't think I'd feel morally right attending if the fantastic community asset we have now was destroyed. What's the point of having a 'fantastic community asset' if we don't have a team/club? There no reason why we can't always have a club as a fan-owned entity. The division we play in should be a secondary thought. I'm not saying we shouldn't strive to play at the highest level, and I have ambitions for us outside of 'just having a club', but fan ownership is the best thing about this club. Yes, there are things that can be improved at the moment, but the thing with our model is that they WILL improve if we, as fans, feel they need to. That wouldn't be the case under private ownership.
|
|
|
Post by rossettred on Mar 18, 2018 19:30:49 GMT
Unless a true fan came up on the Euro lottery and wanted to invest then its fan ownership for me, whatever division that meant.
We have been done over by by scumbag owners too many times, as have you, to think otherwise…
It does mean the same people have to put their hands in their pockets time and time again but it's worth it to me.
|
|
|
Post by spencerwhelanleftpeg on Mar 18, 2018 19:39:04 GMT
A resolution is proposed by one CFU member, it needs the backing of a percentage of the membership to be formally put forward then, if successful, it goes to a vote for the wider CFU membership, to answer the question simply. For the record I'd vote against it every time. Point taken but most would of voted for the board our fans not to have been frivolous with the budget but that was impossible to achieve. So presently it’s difgivult to put trust in anyone regardless if it’s fan onwenership or private investment
|
|
|
Post by billyw on Mar 18, 2018 19:41:07 GMT
What's the point of having a 'fantastic community asset' if we don't have a team/club? There no reason why we can't always have a club as a fan-owned entity. The division we play in should be a secondary thought. I'm not saying we shouldn't strive to play at the highest level, and I have ambitions for us outside of 'just having a club', but fan ownership is the best thing about this club. Yes, there are things that can be improved at the moment, but the thing with our model is that they WILL improve if we, as fans, feel they need to. That wouldn't be the case under private ownership. The fanbase seems to be split between those who are happy with a community club even if the Evostick is the limit of our ambitions while others want to see football played at a higher level even if this means private investment. I fall into the latter category but it would be interesting to have an unofficial poll to see which model people on here prefer.
|
|
|
Post by catfordbags on Mar 18, 2018 19:43:28 GMT
Interesting question which regularly comes up on here however I've yet to hear of an example from the last 35 years of an individual with the both the money and the good intentions to invest and run the club properly. Baring in mind that with current model there is nothing stopping outside investment, it seems an unrealistic aspiration.
|
|
|
Post by billyw on Mar 18, 2018 19:48:06 GMT
Unless a true fan came up on the Euro lottery and wanted to invest then its fan ownership for me, whatever division that meant. We have been done over by by scumbag owners too many times, as have you, to think otherwise… It does mean the same people have to put their hands in their pockets time and time again but it's worth it to me. I'm not sure you would be saying that if you were consigned to the Evostick league. We have both been the victims of rogue owners but the majority of clubs are privately owned without experiencing the problems we've had.
|
|
|
Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Mar 18, 2018 22:17:10 GMT
Interesting question which regularly comes up on here however I've yet to hear of an example from the last 35 years of an individual with the both the money and the good intentions to invest and run the club properly. Baring in mind that with current model there is nothing stopping outside investment, it seems an unrealistic aspiration. That's the key point isn't it? Any rich benefactor would be very welcome to invest in the club - I'm sure we would welcome them with open arms. Of course, they'd have to accept the "one share one vote" method of ownership we have but if they weren't happy with that then you would have to question their motive...
|
|
|
Post by southwalesblue on Mar 18, 2018 23:25:05 GMT
I'm a bit torn on this one. We've possibly had the worst owners over the past 20 odd years than any other club. Brighton, Luton and Portsmouth have also been screwed but hey are all relatively big clubs that were probably always going to come out the other side. I like the idea of a fan based ownership, but lets be honest we have struggled since we got back into the National league. I think we need some outside investment to get get us up the ladder - I've pointed out before that Newport County got that with the help of a local multi millionaire, but once back in the Football League, he handed over his shares to the supporters trust. Point being, once back in the football league, TV money kicks in and there is less reliance on outside investment if the club is run well. Does anyone know if 'local millionaire' Michael Owen has ever expressed any interest in investing in the club? Or say getting £X off say 100 local businesses?
|
|
|
Post by midfieldgeneral on Mar 18, 2018 23:32:17 GMT
The day it goes out of fans ownership is the day I finally throw my hand in. Have you fu king idiots learnt nothing over the past 20 years?
|
|
|
Post by Blockhead on Mar 19, 2018 0:02:06 GMT
Surely any 'benefactor' who had good intentions would accept the one man, one vote man system?
If they didn't have good intentions, and have the best interest of the club at heart, they would not.
It's as simple as that.
Any individual that is after a return (finanucilly or otherwise - control, power, reputation, etc etc.) is not in it for the football club, but themselves. If that doesn't convince the majority of OUR club to support the fan ownership model, then it's no longer OUR club.
|
|
|
Post by devablue on Mar 19, 2018 3:25:20 GMT
Say a well respected, particularly wealthy, local fan/investor did come along with promises to add finance to the first team and improve the clubs infrastructure. I would like to think it would go down to some sort of vote/poll of current CFU members. I mean, i highly doubt anything like that is in place, but worth a thought.
|
|
|
Post by Captain Duff on Mar 19, 2018 6:38:24 GMT
Say a well respected, particularly wealthy, local fan/investor did come along with promises to add finance to the first team and improve the clubs infrastructure. I would like to think it would go down to some sort of vote/poll of current CFU members. I mean, i highly doubt anything like that is in place, but worth a thought. What are you on about, there is no need for an y votes or polls they can do that now - and already are doing it now, how do you think the youth academy survives!
|
|
|
Post by Hannibal on Mar 19, 2018 7:36:08 GMT
I'm a bit torn on this one. We've possibly had the worst owners over the past 20 odd years than any other club. Brighton, Luton and Portsmouth have also been screwed but hey are all relatively big clubs that were probably always going to come out the other side. I like the idea of a fan based ownership, but lets be honest we have struggled since we got back into the National league. I think we need some outside investment to get get us up the ladder - I've pointed out before that Newport County got that with the help of a local multi millionaire, but once back in the Football League, he handed over his shares to the supporters trust. Point being, once back in the football league, TV money kicks in and there is less reliance on outside investment if the club is run well. Does anyone know if 'local millionaire' Michael Owen has ever expressed any interest in investing in the club? Or say getting £X off say 100 local businesses? That Lottery winner actually fell out with the club and left and demanded his investment back, which he eventually got. This came from a friend of mine who is a Newport fan who moved up here to work.
|
|
|
Post by Hannibal on Mar 19, 2018 7:38:38 GMT
Surely any 'benefactor' who had good intentions would accept the one man, one vote man system? If they didn't have good intentions, and have the best interest of the club at heart, they would not. It's as simple as that. Any individual that is after a return (finanucilly or otherwise - control, power, reputation, etc etc.) is not in it for the football club, but themselves. If that doesn't convince the majority of OUR club to support the fan ownership model, then it's no longer OUR club. That's a great misspelling of 'financially'.
|
|
|
Post by billyw on Mar 19, 2018 7:42:52 GMT
The day it goes out of fans ownership is the day I finally throw my hand in. Have you fu king idiots learnt nothing over the past 20 years? Is there any need to be offensive to those who have a different opinion to you. i thought this was a serious adult debate. As far as the past 20 years, yes we have been done over more than once but the majority of clubs with investors have been ok. .
|
|
|
Post by billyw on Mar 19, 2018 7:48:39 GMT
Surely any 'benefactor' who had good intentions would accept the one man, one vote man system? If they didn't have good intentions, and have the best interest of the club at heart, they would not. It's as simple as that. Any individual that is after a return (finanucilly or otherwise - control, power, reputation, etc etc.) is not in it for the football club, but themselves. If that doesn't convince the majority of OUR club to support the fan ownership model, then it's no longer OUR club. It's not as simple as that though. As a keen Chester supporter would you invest £500k and not have any control as to how your money would be managed. Presumably you would have been happy to leave it in the hands of an incompetent Board and could now have lost your investment.
|
|
|
Post by Malcolm Tucker on Mar 19, 2018 7:49:54 GMT
I don’t understand how supporters of a club who’ve suffered as much at the hands of private owners in the past as we have could seriously want to go back there.
Christ, everyone else must be laughing at us because owning your own club is something to be envious of and people want to pack it in because they can’t be bothered rolling their sleeves up.
|
|
|
Post by midfieldgeneral on Mar 19, 2018 7:57:27 GMT
Just one thing to say to those arguing for private ownership. It went really well the last time didnt it? The club ended up being wound up in the high court. The previous manager and board have been incompetent but I remember plenty of times when we were close to the brink under private ownership 1969 70 when we had to sell Billy Dearden and Andy Proven and in the 80s when we had to sell Thomas to Lincoln. Or have people forgot about the bad times? 1980 81 was equally as bad as it is now under private ownership or has selextive memory syndrome kicked in.
|
|
|
Post by Harry Lime on Mar 19, 2018 8:24:01 GMT
What people are saying is that we need an owner who is prepared to put their hand in their pocket to fund a good team for us to watch. That would increase the crowds, and help us to survive at the highest level possible.
How about a thousand owners who actually love their club putting their hands in their collective pockets? How good would that be? No crooked, self centred owner who then decided they want their money back and leave.
If a thousand owners chip in an average of £100 on top of season tickets or turnstile cash, that's £100k. That would increase next season budget by 40%.
The Squad builder allows you to pay a monthly amount by DD. £10pm each would bring in £120k. £25pm bring in £300k. That doubles our budget. Then we'd likely have a team worth watching.
Is that worth £10 - £25 PM to you?
That is the ideal owner(s) for our club. Maybe we need to take some responsibility in our club instead of bleating about the model. Unless more people do something to change things those wanting an outside owner will either get one, or more likely, have no club to support. Could go either way imo.
|
|
|
Post by Al on Mar 19, 2018 8:42:37 GMT
Private ownership?
No ta. Still got the mental scars from the last bunch of vindictive clowns.
The day we return to private ownership is the day I turn my back on the football club.
|
|
|
Post by billyw on Mar 19, 2018 8:44:58 GMT
What people are saying is that we need an owner who is prepared to put their hand in their pocket to fund a good team for us to watch. That would increase the crowds, and help us to survive at the highest level possible. How about a thousand owners who actually love their club putting their hands in their collective pockets? How good would that be? No crooked, self centred owner who then decided they want their money back and leave. If a thousand owners chip in an average of £100 on top of season tickets or turnstile cash, that's £100k. That would increase next season budget by 40%. The Squad builder allows you to pay a monthly amount by DD. £10pm each would bring in £120k. £25pm bring in £300k. That doubles our budget. Then we'd likely have a team worth watching. Is that worth £10 - £25 PM to you? That is the ideal owner(s) for our club. Maybe we need to take some responsibility in our club instead of bleating about the model. Unless more people do something to change things those wanting an outside owner will either get one, or more likely, have no club to support. Could go either way imo. I agree with you and I will happily give yet another £100 donation so you only need another 999 to do likewise - good luck with that.
|
|