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Post by Hannibal on Jun 29, 2018 12:44:33 GMT
The match commander on the day of the Hillsborough disaster David Dukenfield will face trial for the manslaughter by gross negligence of 95 football supporters, a judge has said.
Pity it couldn't have happened 25 years ago.
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Post by rjshbdhmtrm on Jun 29, 2018 13:07:14 GMT
The match commander on the day of the Hillsborough disaster David Dukenfield will face trial for the manslaughter by gross negligence of 95 football supporters, a judge has said. Pity it couldn't have happened 25 years ago. Duckenfield like all his gutless cronies will plead not guilty.
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Post by g1 on Jun 29, 2018 13:41:07 GMT
He will get a token stretch of 3 years guaranteed
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Post by superman on Jun 29, 2018 15:24:34 GMT
The match commander on the day of the Hillsborough disaster David Dukenfield will face trial for the manslaughter by gross negligence of 95 football supporters, a judge has said. Pity it couldn't have happened 25 years ago. Duckenfield like all his gutless cronies will plead not guilty. Let us hope he/they do the right thing and plead guilty. Agreed the whole issue should have been effectively dealt with decades ago. Difficult to see how any jury would not now convict as enough evidence in public domain never mind what might be rehashed at new trial. Could you get 12 jurors with a clear and open mind, I am not sure, and in there lies a moral if not legal problem.
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Post by rjshbdhmtrm on Jun 29, 2018 15:32:46 GMT
Duckenfield like all his gutless cronies will plead not guilty. Let us hope he/they do the right thing and plead guilty. Agreed the whole issue should have been effectively dealt with decades ago. Difficult to see how any jury would not now convict as enough evidence in public domain never mind what might be rehashed at new trial. Could you get 12 jurors with a clear and open mind, I am not sure, and in there lies a moral if not legal problem. Not a cats chance in hell will any of them offer a guilty plea.👹
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Post by Hannibal on Jun 29, 2018 15:42:07 GMT
If I remember correctly Dukinfield replaced the guy who was the regular commander, but unfortunately he had little or no experience in doing the job in front of him. He made many errors which resulted in the carnage that ensued. I think the real culprits are the people that falsified evidence and tried to divert blame to innocent supporters. To me the S*n and Kelvin McKenzie should be in the dock also.
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Post by rjshbdhmtrm on Jun 29, 2018 15:48:25 GMT
If I remember correctly Dukinfield replaced the guy who was the regular commander, but unfortunately he had little or no experience in doing the job in front of him. He made many errors which resulted in the carnage that ensued. I think the real culprits are the people that falsified evidence and tried to divert blame to innocent supporters. To me the S*n and Kelvin McKenzie should be in the dock also. Totally agree, Brian Mole was the original choice as match day commander I think.
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Post by mrswoman on Jun 29, 2018 21:23:04 GMT
wrong decision for me, what is the point of potentially jailing this man after all these years? terrible decisions were made on that day but to charge him with manslaughter - why, who does it benefit? seems very vindictive and like offering up a sacrificial lamb to the families of the dead. Of course i can't even begin to think of their pain and anguish, but this just seems wrong to me.
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Post by Frank Owen’s Paintbrush on Jun 29, 2018 22:10:57 GMT
wrong decision for me, what is the point of potentially jailing this man after all these years? terrible decisions were made on that day but to charge him with manslaughter - why, who does it benefit? seems very vindictive and like offering up a sacrificial lamb to the families of the dead. Of course i can't even begin to think of their pain and anguish, but this just seems wrong to me. Is this the justice they want? Genuine question.
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Post by eyeswideopen on Jun 30, 2018 8:56:23 GMT
Some posts removed including the original quote, which one person has reported as offensive.
Not sure if it was offensive, but certainly insensitive.
The thread is about the match day commander, please keep it on topic.
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Post by Hannibal on Jun 30, 2018 9:46:34 GMT
Some posts removed including the original quote, which one person has reported as offensive. Not sure if it was offensive, but certainly insensitive. The thread is about the match day commander, please keep it on topic. Don't think it was offensive, but I do think it was the type of thing a Manc would put up.
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Post by Lobster on Jun 30, 2018 10:01:46 GMT
Some posts removed including the original quote, which one person has reported as offensive. Not sure if it was offensive, but certainly insensitive. The thread is about the match day commander, please keep it on topic. Don't think it was offensive, but I do think it was the type of thing a Manc would put up. Aside from being offensive, insensitive or whatever, it was also an inaccurate comment, as even Mr Duckinfield now admits.
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Post by Hannibal on Jun 30, 2018 10:16:57 GMT
Don't think it was offensive, but I do think it was the type of thing a Manc would put up. Aside from being offensive, insensitive or whatever, it was also an inaccurate comment, as even Mr Duckinfield now admits. My post saying the Liverpool fans were exonerated at the inquest has been removed. If you are going to remove offensive or insensitive posts that post certainly wasn't either.
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Post by Captain Duff on Jun 30, 2018 12:32:26 GMT
wrong decision for me, what is the point of potentially jailing this man after all these years? terrible decisions were made on that day but to charge him with manslaughter - why, who does it benefit? seems very vindictive and like offering up a sacrificial lamb to the families of the dead. Of course i can't even begin to think of their pain and anguish, but this just seems wrong to me. What a very odd post. For starters everyone who has ever been charged with murder or manslaughter has by default been after the event, and often by many years due to various reasons. But justice means that if you are responsible for the avoidable deaths of anyone one (let alone 96 people) then the law must be applied. Or is it the case that if a son, daughter, brother, sister, parent of your own had been unlawfully killed by the actions of someone else and you knew who they were you would be relaxed about that person getting off with it, continuing to live as if nothing had happened, continuing to get their large pension while you were still grieving for the loss (because that never ends)? If you can honestly say yes then you either aren't human or you really haven't thought through the issues here. Besides, the law should be about holding criminals to account, even ones who made mistakes rather than pre-meditated acts. H&S law is the same, and about holding organisations and individuals to account for avoidable accidents or avoidable deaths, it is what separates us from a gangster state, as does not having anyone, including police officers, above the law themselves. Duckenfield is a nasty horrible individual in my opinion, a proven liar and someone content to go along with blaming the victims for his crimes. He deserves to rot for the rest of his miserable life in prison, but he is not alone in his guilt and those that were active in the deliberate flasification of evidence, the destruction of police notebooks, the altering of statements, the lies given to the media, all of those people should also be charged too, because while the families of the 96 have finally had the truth, they are still waiting for justice.
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Post by bonecrusher on Jun 30, 2018 17:36:21 GMT
wrong decision for me, what is the point of potentially jailing this man after all these years? terrible decisions were made on that day but to charge him with manslaughter - why, who does it benefit? seems very vindictive and like offering up a sacrificial lamb to the families of the dead. Of course i can't even begin to think of their pain and anguish, but this just seems wrong to me. I know what you are saying. The man made terrible mistakes which cost many lives and has to live with that every single day of his life, which, unless he is heartless beyond belief much be unimaginable. However, if he is criminally negligent then he has to stand trial. You can't not be prosecuted for a crime because it happened ages ago. I agree that a prison sentence is probably not in the public interest or expense. I hope that a conviction (if guilty) will serve some of the justice the families deserve. Let's not also forge though, that this man blatantly lied about the actions of the fans to save his own neck by stating that the fans forced the gate, when in fact he (disastrously) ordered it to be opened. I actually think this was the worst of his actions. No-one at Hillsborough deliberately made strategic errors to cause deaths, it was a catalogue of many things and a culture and perception of football fans at the time. The tragedy was coming and if it hadn't happened that day it would have been elsewhere. The following cover up by the South Yorkshire police (started by Duckenfield's lies about the fans forcing the gate) and the powers that be at the time and beyond is the real disgrace.
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Post by eyeswideopen on Jul 2, 2018 7:26:50 GMT
Aside from being offensive, insensitive or whatever, it was also an inaccurate comment, as even Mr Duckinfield now admits. My post saying the Liverpool fans were exonerated at the inquest has been removed. If you are going to remove offensive or insensitive posts that post certainly wasn't either. Your post wasn't deemed offensive, however you quoted the post that was reported, therefore your post was removed along with the original.
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Post by Hannibal on Jul 2, 2018 9:29:01 GMT
My post saying the Liverpool fans were exonerated at the inquest has been removed. If you are going to remove offensive or insensitive posts that post certainly wasn't either. Your post wasn't deemed offensive, however you quoted the post that was reported, therefore your post was removed along with the original. Ok fair enough!
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